CANADA IS AT WAR - THIS IS NOT ABOUT TARIFFS

Welcome to The O Show, Canada's pro -democracy podcast.I'm your host, Laura Babcock, and it is a power cast.We've got Charlie Angus from Midas Canada, the Midas Mighty.I spent my weekend whitewater rafting in the Ottawa River, And it kind of reminds me a little bit of how the news is going these days.You get a little bit of peace, Charlie.You're kind of sitting out there floating nice.

And then all of a sudden, they're like, oh, yeah, around that corner is another rapid.We're going to yell, hold on, and then get down.And then you get slammed by a wall of water hard in the face.And every time that we went through that this weekend, I was like, that's what it feels like listening to the news.Because this morning, we're hearing talk of World War III coming from leaders of other countries.How was your weekend?

Well, Laura, yeah, I was in the nation's capital.And, you know, I want to give a big shout out to everybody that stopped me on the street and said how much they love what we're doing.They love the power cast.And people are not dropping, they haven't dropped the ball.Canadians get it, but I got to say, I'm getting increasingly concerned.You know, we've talked about, are we in the beginning of third world war?

I think closer to home, we are at war.There is a clear war with the United States.The language is there, you know, an economic war.This isn't a trade war.This is a unilateral constant attack.And I think we're at the point where we're going to have to really make some tough decisions and expect our leaders to take tough decisions about how to defend our sovereignty at this time.

So we're not.Nickel and diming our nation away, trying to hope that these guys are going to be nice to us.They are not.They keep coming back.They keep coming back harder.So I like to, you know, I think ordinary Canadians get the mission.

but we obviously have real issues with some of our leaders and some of the positions that are being taken.So we've got to be honest with people.I'd love to give you the rah -rah.I'd love to give you the elbows up and, you know, pom -poms.And we've got this.We've got this if we're smart and we've got this if we're determined and we've got this if we're honest.

And we got a little clear eyed about what's coming at us because it is coming at us in a big way.

We are at war and and it's serious and we have to get into that.And when I mentioned World War Three, I mean, I'm talking about China bringing it up now and I'm talking about Iran threatening Ukraine based on Ukraine hitting one of their tankers.We're doing this event to support Ukraine coming up in August because they're like right in the thick of it.

So what we're talking about, folks, is August 13th.We're doing a live event.Laura and I, the dynamic duo, democracy at Niagara West Secondary School in beautiful Niagara region.The tickets are going well.The tickets are going fast.Get them while you can.

But we're raising money for Ukraine, but we're also raising money for the people of Cuba who are facing the horrific illegal boycott of Marco Rubio and the Trump administration trying to break another country in our hemisphere.And again, we know Ukraine falls, Cuba falls, Venezuela fell.The Columbia is under threat.They're coming for us and they've never lost.They've never dropped the attack on us.No matter what we see in Washington, it's always focused on us.

So we are going to be raising money.It's going to be a great evening and we're going to be talking about these issues.And so bring out your questions, bring out your thoughts, bring out your Canadian flags and join us in Niagara on August 13th.

I can't wait and I will say one of the things that buoyed my spirits driving back from Ottawa, there was one town that had a Canadian flag on every single flag, like every single light post and all the houses and the garages.It was justso moving, you know, and it wasn't for a Canada Day celebration.It's an everyday thing.And so I think Canadians, we know that we're constantly being attacked by the U .

S.Well, I think the issue, you know, that we've, we've got to talk about, like, this is not Trump being Trump.And this is again, where the pundits in our media class miss the issue all the time.Um, acting like they treat Pete Hoekstra, lying Pete Hoekstra, you know, as though, well, why is the United States upset with us?Like we have given up again and again, Eric Blaze writing in the Toronto Star talked about, we're giving up our nation in installments and we have to start realizing like the pattern.Every time we give up something and we say, it's no big deal.

Oh, we're being reasonable.They see that as weakness.So, you know, we gave up the digital services tax.We agreed on this fentanyl czar, which was ridiculous, and they moved on from that immediately.Stop some of the tariffs that we put on under Prime Minister Trudeau as a way of being reasonable.I mean, we allowed the bridge agreement to be reopened.

That was outrageous.And then what did we get?We got right after that 50 % arbitrary tariffs thrown on us, plus Trump now saying more tariffs, and then we have the language coming out.of like an Ohio senator talking about seizing the assets of Canadian leaders and expelling the diplomatic corps.This is what you do when you are at war with the country.And the pattern that we're seeing now is that we reached a point where the next time they come, and they're coming at us in 27, 26 days now, are we going to say, well, let's wait and talk?

Or are we going to say, no, this is the line in the sand moment.It was what Trudeau did, Prime Minister Trudeau did in March 2025 when he said he realized we'd run out of time.and we stood up and they backed off.They are relentless in the attack and they're coming at us again and again.So I think the Prime Minister needs now to recognize that being the reasonable guy, being the adult in the room, we're not dealing with adults.We're dealing with thugs.

We're dealing with gangsters.You know, they're going to burn our house to the ground.They don't care how reasonable we are.They want the property.This is, I think, the moment we're at, and to recognize that the language coming at us is more and more aggressive all the time.

You can never satisfy a bully.If they see you as a soft target, they're always going to take from you.Why would they stop suddenly and say, OK, well, we're done.We've punished Canada sufficiently.They actually want what we have.As a Canadian business guy said, that I think helped start all this madness, we're just 44 million people on all the minerals the U .

S.covets, right?So the US covets what we have, at least the Trump administration does.And no amount of niceness and reasonable response and half measures from us is going to satiate their desire to have what we have.I mean, that's just the way predators work.That's not something that terribly anyone wants to think about.

That's not something anyone wants to believe.But the rhetoric and the actions behind it and these attempts at legislation, and I get so mad I've had a couple of conversations with some business people or leaders in Canada recently, and one of them's like, you know, it's illegal what he's doing with these tariffs, so we should just ignore it.And I'm like, do you think legality has any place in a regime that's trying to get rid of the international courts, right, that doesn't believe in international oversight?Like, what legality are exactly you hoping for, that the Supreme Court is going to stop him?He stopped, they stopped him on the other tariffs, and he found a workaround, right?So like, there's no

legal defense against that.these guys, because as you said, they're gangsters and thugs.They don't care about the law.And then I had a conversation with someone else who's like, Laura, you got to just ignore.This is just Trump being Trump.Ignore it and it'll go away.

It'll die down.Don't give it oxygen.I understand it's easier to ignore it for some people, but I look at it from a comms perspective, and that's like letting the narrative completely get away from you, where you don't even try to contain it or control it or direct it.I mean, we're just supposed to throw hands up in this country and say anything you want about us, lie about us, threaten us, do all these things and we're just gonna just hope it goes away in the midterms in under a hundred days.People who are thinking that way, I think it's understandable but delusional.

Yeah, I think I think that this is the issue of there are a lot of people and this is why they watch our shows Because they get the threat and then there's the pundit class the business class everyone telling us It's a you know, just just just be calm and carry on.Well, there's no calm and carrying on when you're dealing with fascist threat So many people learned those lessons, you know, Jason Stanley in his book on fascism writes about you know, the people in Germany who waited and waited and waited to leave until it was too late.two weeks, the Prime Minister is going to have to send a message.He's done great work on the international stage, but like the handling and the response on the Gordie Howbridge, I mean, what he told us wasn't factual, not from what I've been able to read.We need to hear a clear message of the Prime Minister rallying us in the face of the fact that we know that Premier Daniel Smith and Premier Mo are undermining us at every opportunity.But I think the Prime Minister is going to have to put some stuff on the table, like potash.

uh light electricity coming from Ontario, Quebec, Canada.and like critical minerals coming from BC and Ontario and Quebec to say that these are the areas that we're going to come at you.Now, Premier Mo is going to lose his mind because he's bent over backwards to please the MAGA regime.But potash is key to the US farm economy.And either we put serious stuff on the table or the threats are going to increase.And when they're talking about seizing assets of Canadian leaders like premiers, they're talking about war.

And maybe it's just a mega politician, but more mega politicians are using this language and Trump is baiting them in this.So I think we're at this moment where we're looking to the prime minister and saying, okay, you're the smart guy.You're the guy that plays four dimensional chess.I don't see any more moves here other than to say, I'm sorry to the bully, but I'm going to have to get up and kick your ass.

financial tools internationally that probably the Carney would see as levers that could be pulled.You know, Trump bases everything on the stock market, but there are other ways to terrify the U .S.and one of it is their bond market.I think anyone is naive or Pollyannic enough to think that Mark Carney can fix all and handle all, but we think we've got a pretty good war leader in right now.he needs to treat us like we're part of the solution, right?

Not just say, oh, Canada, we're going to be stronger.We're doing this, that, and the other thing for you.We're giving you this benefit, that benefit.He needs to sit down and say, OK, folks, this is the plan.The premiers, we've got this plan.This is what we need from everyday Canadians.

Because we've got no opposition functioning in this country.We're the hell of the NDP.The Conservatives are falling apart at the seams.

No, I absolutely agree.And I want to be really clear about this with Prime Minister Carney.If you read the book Regime Change,you will see not just how vindictive and dangerous Trump is, but that he's surrounded by sycophants who are willing to be even more dangerous to win his approval.So I can see why the Prime Minister is super careful.I can see why the Prime Minister acts super chill that he doesn't respond publicly when It makes sense.

I think he has an understanding of just how vicious Trump is for the smallest little slight that he will come at you.But there is that point.where we actually then have to say, okay, this is what we're dealing with.We're dealing with a very vicious predator and giving up and hoping that he's going to come back to the table.There is no table to come to.He's going to take the table as well.

And we're in this situation where we don't have the normal balance in parliament of an opposition that actually then holds the Prime Minister to account.I don't know where Pierre Polyev is gone after he showed up at Calgary with his Lethbridge Liberace outfit, and he's got Jamil Javani out there fighting some weird culture war as JD Vance's sock puppet, thinking that he's blaming Mark Carney for something like the Democrats in the US.Nobody's paying attention to this.But my own part of the NDP, I'm getting these fundraising appeals saying that Mark Carney, the warmonger, is co -signed onto to the Iran war.Well, that's not true.That's not true.

And we know that's not true.So what we need from opposition is a vision to say to the Prime Minister, where are we going as a nation?How do we rally the people as a nation?You call out the Prime Minister when the Prime Minister isn't doing the job.But we right now, we are in a war economy.We're in a war situation.

We're all in the trench together.So to have the opposition playing in sandboxes that nobody's interested,in, and they're the king of the sandbox, whatever, it falls to ordinary Canadians.That's why I think the urgency of what we're doing day after day after day on our shows, saying to people, you've got to take the tools, and the tools work.Look at what happened with the Billy Bishop Airport in Toronto.I mean, Doug Ford got pushed back.

It was people power that did that.People standing up did that.forced the Prime Minister to change position when he came out with the lukewarm position on Iran.People said, whoa, be clear.And so it's up to us.We are the voice of Canada right now.

Ordinary Canadians, the people in those small towns where you see those Canadian flags, they are Canada.They are the frontline defenders.So I think the Prime Minister needs to also trust them, to trust Canadians and say, we're not here to screw things over, Prime Minister, but we are here to defend our country.tell us how, tell us what the plan is, and you don't have to tell us everything you're planning, but we need also to be understood that we are here to do our part.

If we don't have a strong opposition at all, then it's so important for us to have, you know, the media out there telling us the truth and bringing us up to date and having a serious conversation.I saw a headline.It wasn't the article.It wasn't the point of the argument.But, you know, the clickbait on a headline on CTV was Can Canada survive the 92 days until the midterms?I went bananas because I'm like, what the hell?

You put out that headline from a Canadian from CTV that, you know, can Canada survive?92 more days.I'm like, what the hell, Charlie, of course, we're going to survive 92 years.And then just the concept of that, you like, what are you telling people that they should just give up now?Like, is thislike, we're supposed to, you know, agree in advance?

We're supposed to submit in advance?Like, I just, it makes me nuts.It makes me nuts.It's the exact opposite of what we need.If we don't have strong opposition, if they're denigrating the country, or they're lying about what the prime minister's doing in war, and then we've got the media in this country, corporately owned, you know, making us, do we need to query whether or not we're going to survive until the US midterms?I mean, come on.

The midterms are going to be whatever they're going to do what they're going to do.We have to decide what we're going to do but I would say to that, you know, some of our colleagues in this new online sphere of podcasting, I get people sending me podcasts from some of the other voices out there saying, Charlie, you've got to really get your facts right.Watch I don't want to fight with these other podcasters, but I'm looking at and I'm like, I don't think that's true.I know people really want the cheerleading.I want to cheerlead, but we don't cheerlead helpfully.We don't have our facts.

The facts are that we are in a very tough position.We don't have all the cards.We aren't doing the most brilliant moves to outplay Donald Trump.And Carney said the one word that smacked them down.And these are all these kind of headlines I'm seeing.We got to just be, we got to take a deep breath, realize we've got the Juno Beach gene in us.

We're still a long way into this fight.And it's our job as voices at this time that what you and I do is to try and present to people what we're actually seeing, what concerns us and what gives us hope so that people feel like, yeah, we can do this.People can do this.Our people power is amazing.I would like to see the government actually lean in on the boycott in a bigger way.I mean, we got to start taking on the grocery giants.

They are underminingthe boycott with these fake prepared in Canada things.The produce is still overwhelmingly from the United States.Let's get some support here.This is people have been doing this on their own.So let's get some support.

We need to see the Prime Minister come back with a plan.We can't live with these 50 % tariffs.He's a lot smarter on tariffs than I am, but I know that unless we start throwing down some serious ones that will shake up places like Nebraska and Montana and South Dakota and Ohio and Illinois that are dependent on potash or states like New York and Vermont that are dependent on electricity, then they're just going to come and take something else next.And we know that they're their tariffs are illegal.Yeah, you can't tariff smoke.We know that.

But that's not what this is about.This is about getting us to give ground so that we give up.We've got to hold our ground and it's up to us as sort of the voices of independent media to give people the facts and trust Canadians.I trust Canadians.I trust if we give them the facts, they know exactly what the issues are and what we got to do.So I'd much rather be in trenches with Canadians than in trenches with all the rest of them combined.

We can do this.

If there is a red line, if Carney does set a red line, then he's got to live up to that red line because we've seen Ford be all bellicose and then all lovey towards the Americans.cut the Starling deal, then gave the Starling deal back, then cut the Starling deal.That kind of back and forth vacillation is not helping with sending a clear signal.You can't be the bully one minute and then a total sycophant to Americans the next minute and then a bully.It sends a distorted message.I think it's just more about his own need for relevancy and to kiss up to Americans and then his own temper.

But it's that kind of chaos.I don't think the good cop, bad cop thing please.I think he'dlooks like he's not connected to the broader strategy.I mean, Carney was hired to speak to the U .S.

to deal with this madness, and he should be the person who is making the decisions and who is going out there and talking to the Americans, not Doug Ford because he's mad on a Monday and trying to save his approval ratings on a Tuesday.And we also have to recognize that Doug Ford, is going down as fast as his gravy plane, and he's bringing the whole gravy class of grifters of his MPPs who are now being exposed for the way that they have played around with the tax dollar in Ontario.People told me that he would never be beatable.He even put out there that he's doing a fourth term, that he can't be stopped, right?People said, oh, we'll take the summer, Laura.He'll come back.

Folks here are more popular than ever because he's Doug Ford.No, people protest.He's going down.People aren't putting up with it.They stopped his move on the Billy Bishop airport.They've shown that they can beat this guy with the right amount of public opposition, and it's not going to stop.

He's got nowhere to go.So him out there throwing things at America to try to, you know, satiate whatever his emotional needs are is not what's good for our country at a time of war.He needs to sit down.We need to hear from people like Wab Kanu and E .

B.Well, I agree, but I think it's also in terms of where the Prime Minister needs to be.Premier Eby has been strong.Premier Wapkanu, I mean, he is Captain Canada right now.But, you know, say if we put the potash threat on and we have Smith and Mo lose their minds.Well, fine.

Go for it.They're going to do that anyways.They've been undermining us from the get -go.But you think of all the people in Saskatchewan and Alberta who are more than patriotic, people who are going to defend their country.The Prime Minister has to stare down the MAGA threat.the fifth columnist mega threat and say, I'm going to take this fight.

We're going to have to stand up and it's going to be all of us and all regions of Canada are going to have to to play a part in order to defend all of Canada.So I trust that the prime minister understands this.He doesn't need to say anything until he does it, but I think it's going to have to happen because Trump is already now threatening us again.And now he's hurt that we didn't invite him to the bridge opening.I mean, this is what the narcissistic psychopath does, right?This is what they do in their to the hostage family that they're engaged in terrorizing.

And we can't be terrorized.We have to say, no, we're going to do what we're going to do.And you're going to do what you're going to do.And we know what you're going to do because you're a criminal.He's a criminal.

And he's backed by people who support a criminal.

We are not a criminal nation.We are a democratic nation.So I think this is the road ahead.

I too am reading regime change.It's clear that you're dealing with a toxic stew of grifters and criminals and sociopaths.And there's not going to be any time where they are pleased or where it's good enough or that we're behaving well enough.Right.We're never going to please them.It reminds me of that line.

Is there no pleasing you, Mr. Bond?Right.There is no pleasing.this administration, they just take and take and take and take and take.If people can start thinking of it that way, that they're not capable of not being predatory.They're only beatable if you stand up to them.

As uncomfortable as it is, Charlie, as much as it sucks, we have to realize that until this regime is gone in all of its facets, that we are facing something that is going to come at us and not stop.And there's no amount of niceness, no amount of give that is going to change how we live.And that's hard.That's hard because we're good people and we like to believe in redemption.We like to believe in relationship building.We like to believe in conflict resolution.

That's not an option with the Trump regime.

I mean, it's what we do until we fight back.And then when we fight back, man, watch out.It's the Juno Beach team.But I do want to say, you know, having been in the nation's capital this past weekend and talking to people, And people stopping me on the street and thanking for the work we're doing in that.But they were some of the shop owners were telling me they've had an unprecedented number of European visitors and American visitors.We've got friends in the world.

Yes.People are looking to Canada.You know, it may feel like we're on our own, but we are not.And so we've got so many people who are supporting and understand what we've got to do.And so many Canadians, the prime minister needs to know Canadians are going to do their part.If he has to come out and tell us, yeah, this is going to be a real rough patch, but do you think that the American establishment is going to allow Trump to continue carrying on if suddenly really key critical minerals are going to Europe instead of the United States because we tariff the United States or potash, which their farms are dependent on, that they're not going to back down?

and electricity, same thing.We have to put this on the table.

It's a crazy, crazy time.But at the same time, there are signals that the MAGA party in Canada can fall apart, that Trump can implode, you know, Ford's numbers are going down.I mean, pushback works, democracy works.We have to look at the small wins and celebrate them like the Island Airport in Toronto.Because you know, it matters and don't ever give up on that.Let's speak together as a world of good people.

There are more of us than the bad, Charlie.

absolutely.I mean, as we say on Midas Canada, stealing from Bruce Coburn, and it is the Bruce Coburn line that we steal is, you know, we keep kicking in that darkness and it's going to bleed daylight.And I, I'm, you know, there's mornings I wake up and I just, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God, what's, what's, what do we got to do?And then I, I see this, it's my trust as Canadians is my trust is democracy.My trust is in our goodness, but it's also knowing that we're dealing with a very sick predator and who's backed up by predators and those who want to go along with predators.So this is the showdown folks.

And this is this is we didn't sign up for this, but we're here and we're going to see it through because Canadians, once it starts, we don't stop until it's done.

I'll bring it back right around to the whitewater rafting.When you hit that wall of water and you think you're going to die, you remember that you're in a boat with a bunch of other people with paddles and they are going to help you paddle out of that.rapid and through it, right?And so we're not alone.Listen, everybody, have a great start to the week, and we'll be back at you next weekend with whatever the hell goes on this week.

Thank you.Thank you so much.Thank you, Merci and Meegwetch, everybody.