Ex-Freemason: Possessed Politicians, Demonic Rituals for Power, Secret Societies, and the Occult

Sean, thanks for doing this.

It dawned on me the other day, years after it dawned on you, that there are no secular leaders of anything, and that people pose as, you know, science -based and non -religious, but everyone who has power in the world is religious, I have noticed.They just have different religions.And you've been on this for a very long time.So let's just start as big as we can.What's the purpose of communing with the supernatural for leaders.Why do leaders do it?

I think there was some, maybe this is a quote or someone said this to me, there are non -powerful people who are Freemasons, but there are no powerful people who are not Freemasons.

Freemasons?

Freemasons.If you think about the nature of an initiatory group that's been around in its current form for a few hundred years, since the 1700s, right, in the UK, and likewise in France, But they say its origin, or they believe its origin, precedes it to the Knights Templar, who were a very powerful order, as we know, from my understanding of the Templars.it's not the idea of like nine knights showing up in the Middle East during the Crusades, right, to guard the roads, right?It was really more about excavating under the Temple of Solomon.That was, you know, what they were interested were the ancient texts.They wanted to get to the well of souls.

The well of souls, the ancient texts, the things that were, you know, written into like grimoires and hidden, you know, incantations, things that you could basically call upon the spiritual realm, because that's the lore of King Solomon.King Solomon, as we remember from the Bible, you know, he had wisdom and he was a powerful ruler over what was then Israel, but...

Richest man in the world.

Well, he had the gold, but why did he have the power?was because he could call upon what they call jinn, genies, and he could command them with his ring, the ring of Solomon, the ring of power.And that's what he, so the real lore of, like, masonry, right, was that he had this builder, Hiram Abiff, who could, you know, who architected the temple, the Temple of Solomon, but they had jinn that they called upon to actually do the work and to build it.Now that's all metaphor.

And what are djinn?

Genies.What we would call genies in Aladdin's lamp.They are the beings and so I went to Iran the first time was curiosity but I went to go meet with some of these guys that communicate to them to the other side and I would talk to them about you know what's going on in the world and they would say yeah I mean the djinn in Islamic lore is very similar to like angels and demons or the watchers in the Book of Enoch who are not, they're both dark and light.Some serve God, some serve the dark side.And so the idea of like the power of Solomon was to be able to have a relationship and mastery and some people say that he actually got overwhelmed by the power.And that's why he fell, right?

He ended up with the love affair that sort of sank his rulership because it's a very dangerous gambit once you start committing with that side.But all, I believe, all the initiatory paths, Freemasonry is just one of them, the most famous one, lead you to that realm, to the understanding that there's spiritual forces invisible to us that are working through people in this world.And just because someone is a so -called Christian doesn't mean they're serving God.And just because someone is a Muslim doesn't mean they're serving the devil.And it's the same across the entire planet, that there are forces of evil.dark and light working through every religion, every people, even through our own lifetime, our own souls.

You know, at any point, when you grow up in Hollywood or whatnot, you realize, like, it does seem that people can sell their souls and maybe not even be aware of it.Because to me, it's not Satanism, it's like, can be incantations, it can be blood sacrifices and rituals, it can also just be worship of the material realm.So when you get into that realm of like, oh, I want power, I want worldly power, I think that's the satanic path.They don't think of it as such, but materialism at his heart is worship of the earth.And that's why people talk about the earth, it's like, you know, it's kind of Lucifer's domain, right?Because if you worship, if you become, start worshiping money and, you know, and yourself, your own ego, well, you've lost sight of the transcendent power of God.

There's no question about that.There's no question.

And I think all of us experienced that in our own lives.

But just to back to what you initially said about the Masons, so we're about 100 feet from a Masonic lodge.They're all over rural America.They're kind of a vestige of the past.This is how I think of them.A bunch of elderly guys with ceremonial swords.Yeah.

Telling stories.I have one.

You have one.I have one right over there from that lodge.You don't think of them as a threat?or even a meaningful player in current events, but then I should say I don't know much about it.

Yeah.

I don't so at really at all.You joined the Masons.Why did you do that and what was it like?

It was a journey of initiation.I think that Igoing through in that time, right out of college.Because, you know, in my college years, I started getting deep into studying history.And even in the Procopius was writing the history of Justinian, right, the Roman emperor, Byzantine emperor.And he described him as a shape -shifting demon, basically, in that book, in the Secret History.

And that was buried for a long time.And you know, again, there's all types of histories that King James was, was it James's Bible, but he also wrote demonology book, right?I mean, this was the way that it was, the world was perceived and understood for centuries, as we know.

As a battleground between dark and light.

Yeah.I mean, as, as forces that were unseen.I mean, Socrates talked about his, his daemon, like his, you know, but be called genius.But, you know, they say like in the old world, there's a theory that when Homer's writing about you know, the Iliad and, you know, all these different gods having a play in human life.A lot of people believe that we were in communication more readily with beings, right?Unseen beings.

And it may have been a real factor in our consciousness back then.And then we, you know, obviously we get to this place of the enlightenment when all that becomes relegated.And we say, oh, that's all, you know, hocus pocus and not real.We can only focus on the physical realm.but you can't understand how life begins through the physical realm alone.You can't understand how the universe is formed, right?

I mean, okay, how does a big bang start?It just happens, okay.Spontaneous bang.Time travel, I mean, how does it happen?How does it actually begin?Exactly from what?

And how does life begin?So I think a lot of the materialists actually, you could say, people say Darwin and whatnot, are essentially serving the dark side because they're saying there's nothingoutside the material realm.This is all that exists and everything, well, actually all we're interfacing with is our own minds, our own perceptions.And so when they want us to believe, you know, a very simplified version of reality, spontaneous evolution, random evolution, random changes, right, take away anything spiritual, I think that serves the dark side, in a sense, because now it elevates our own egos.It makes us, you know, we're the progenitors of this and, you know, we are the greatest thing in the universe.

And we can get into that later, but that then serves a transhuman agenda that, you know, it's all about perfecting ourselves through the physical plane of genetics, right?Genetic tampering and whatnot.And you try to basically take the spiritual origin impulse of God creating this universe out of the story, right?That's what the enlightenment did in many ways.but you can't take it out because we instinctively as souls that we are in human form, we have this curiosity and this desire to know, okay, where did I come from?My soul didn't just spontaneously appear.

How do I have consciousness?Where does consciousness originate from?Just from our brains?Well, I think we're understanding that our brains are more receivers, almost like computers that can receive the internet that's around us, right?That's the way that we function more in that way, and that's why people have near -death experiences, or they have out -of -body experiences, and they, this is, you know, the CIA does this kind of stuff, astral projection, and they can see things outside of their physical body that you can't say, well, your brain knew it.You have all kinds of cases and stories of this.

You know, people, you know, who are literally on a hospital bed, and they can perceive things in the next room.So consciousness transcends our brain, right?And that indicates, again, a spiritual reality.that a lot of mainstream science wants us to ignore.But I was like looking at history and saying, no, we've always had this impulse to see a spiritual reality or what Plato calls like the ideational realm, the world of ideals, before we get to the material realm.So let's not try to ignore that.

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So I would, you know, study these things and ended up going into, uh, well, I met this guy who was, uh, himself a Mason and, um, he was a Jersey kid who was like my age and we started, he would, he had been exploring these haunted places.New Jersey is notorious for being haunted.They have a whole magazine called Haunted NJ, right?And not just Jersey, but you know, let's say the East Coast.

But especially New Jersey.

Especially New Jersey.They've got some history there.I don't know what it is.And so he was exploring these places like Greystone, which was a massivemental hospital.Woody Guthrie was there, for example.

And you saw it in the recent Bob Dylan movie.He goes and visits Guthrie at the Greystone Mental Hospital.This place was about, for a hundred years, it was one of the biggest mental hospitals in the country.It was the biggest foundation when they built it until they built the Pentagon after.So it was a massive, like we went to this place at night and even though it was shut down, it was still, the lights were still on and it's about five or six stories tall and underground there's tunnels and passages that go on for miles around.So we would go explore this place at night and let's just say that high strangeness ensued.

It's an abandoned mental hospital in New Jersey.

Yeah, yeah.It's an abandoned mental hospital in Jersey.And so from the first time that we went there, and then went back, and each time it would just, different things would reveal themselves to me in a way that, I made a film about it, Greystone Park, to kind of symbolize the way that fear operates to me. I believe that our frequency attracts forces, and so when you go into a place like that, where thousands of people have died, they had like a mass grave, basically thousands of people that had died there over the course of 100 years, and there'd been a lot of abuse, and I think also people go into this place, or they would go into that place, who were themselves, you know, we call mentally ill, but a lot of them I think were demon -possessed.

Yes.

And so imagine it's now becoming a place of very dark energy.

Hard to imagine anything darker than that.

Right, yeah.And so what we saw was like indications, paraphernalia, books, things like this left behind of like satanic rituals, like people would go there and performrituals to draw upon that energy.

And why would someone do that?

Well, so this gets into the nature of this realm, right?If we, again, like we understand like material realm is what we see and what we interact with, what we think we're interacting with, but as we know, At heart, it's all energy.This table is moving particles, right?Our being is, we're moving particles, moving atoms.We're energetic bodies that appear to be fixed, but actually, as we know, we're changing every second, every day.Our cells are dying and being reborn.

Our energy body is moving.And so the spiritual traditions have always understood that because they didn't call it necessarily energy, prana and life force, breath, ruh, right?Like that's the origin of creation is something in spirit is moving through us into this container, this vessel that, you know, that appears fixed.But again, as we know, it's changing.That's why we don't, we don't look the same every day, even if it's just slight differences.And as you know, like you can see in people's You can just, you can kind of see it sometimes, right?

Like you can see when someone's energetically drained.You can see when someone's energy is high and they're vibrant.Instantly.So this is all, this is, this is the energetic nature of reality.So if we are talking about a world that also is energetic and alive, and then you have geometry, let's say it's certain structures, trap energy more than others, right?I mean, if you're outdoors and I mean, we can just experience it, right?

You're out in nature, you're in a forest, the trees are going to have certain energy.It's going to move, you know, maybe like they'llin the course they are living beings, right, so they'll live their life and die.And that's why some forests are called haunted forests or darker, you know, they're darker places.And sometimes you'll have historically, yeah, you'll have places where there'll be gatherings of people to practice, you know, since the pagan times, let's say, right, to practice different rituals.And sometimes you'll feel the energy of that, like, oh, this is a place where, you know, you know, there's a gathering that takes place and a certain energy gets created there.

Same way as like a building, I mean, that's what a haunted house is, right?Like, if you're in a house and it's, you know, someone gets murdered, it's gonna have a heavier energy, right?Because it hasn't, unless you come and bless it and really, I don't know, do the right energy, do the work to move the energy through, to let it pass, right?To let the souls go.And I had that experience with one of the haunted places I went to.It was like a place that was notorious.

It was next to a mental hospital where kids were housed.And this was upstate New York.This was different from Greystone.And in that house next to the mental hospital for kids, the legend has it that a priest that was molesting these kids at that property and actually killing some of the kids and doing black magic And in that house, I saw people get possessed and, you know, we heard the sounds of hell, like coming from, I mean, it's hard to imagine that this is what we experienced.You know, we'd be upstairs and all of a sudden we'd hear howling of dogs and laughter, like demonic laughter and things like this echoing through the house.And so we went back multiple times and we blessed the house and the final time really felt a purging of energy.

and the house burned down on its own within about a month or two.So that's the kind of thing we talk about, like the energy that gets trapped in places until you come with higher frequency of blessing a place and clearing the energy.So again, we're talking of a battle of dark and light, those forces that draw upon dark energy because they can then invoke spirit, let's say darker spirits.that hooks into that.If everything is, let's say like frequency, fear, you know, things that are horrific, horror films play into the psychology, right?It's like Freddy Krueger, right?

He plays, he preys upon, he's a dream demon, right?He infects people with fear and we think about how like demons are what?They're scary, right?They're monstrous, they're shadows, they're things that create fear in us.And then it seems to be like the frequency match almost.

Do you think that's one of the reasons that Jesus so often tells his disciples not to be afraid?

Yes, that's exactly right.So remember when Jesus casts out the demons, he sends them into the swine.He's like, yeah, get out of the human vessel and they go and kill themselves.Because a lot of the demonic, I mean, again, there's different frequency of demonic energy.There's madness, a lot of psychosis we have experiencing in this country, I think connects to it.A lot of it ties into alcohol and drugs.

that's, you know, lowering people's frequency.You know, it's one thing to have, you know, a glass or two, but as we know, a lot of alcohol, what does it do?It takes us out of our right mind.In my experience of seeing people get possessed, it's pretty much like seeing someone, you know, when someone's out of blackout drunk and you've seenwe've all seen it someone's coked up or out of their mind on with alcohol and they behave erratically irrationally they get aggressive they get mean or they start laughing hysterically and the next day they may not remember anything it's exactly what possession is because when you see someone get possessed they just like like it's like a flip a flip of a switch and they go from someone you can look in the eyes and see what they are to just checked out.I've seen people screaming, I've seen people laughing maniacally, I've seen just check out, just staring blankly, but you know it.

You know that this person's not in their right mind.And the key is to try to bring the light back, breathe, bring good energy back, raise the frequency so they can come back to their self, their selves.What I would say this battle is between the darkness that again feeds on that fear, that lower vibrational psyche of not being in our right mind, not being in our higher selves, not being connected to our spirit, to God basically, the spirit that is always available, but the dark side wants to lower that frequency.to a place that would be closer to hell, right?It's always been described as hell, place of torture, of suffering, of pain.

Place of the dead.

Yeah.Well, even worse than death, right?Death is one thing.Go below that, you know, and it's like, that's the level of self -destruction, like you said with the pigs, you know, self -destructiveness.So this is the battle.And again, if the dark side has, you know, waged war on mankind, let's say, right?

If we believe, and this is,you know, this is not just Christian tradition.I mean, this is like a lot of - The story there is.Yeah, it's a lot of stories around the world have talked about this, you know, that there's something that's waging war on mankind.They want possession of the soul.They want us to check out, to surrender, right?

To check out, say, hand over control of the vehicle.And that seems to be the real battle, right?Are we autonomous beings?We have control of our vehicles.I mean, we all experienced this during COVID.Imagine like, you know, all of a sudden it seems so far out, but like during COVID, we actively saw people checked out from fear and like dead body, like dead things, you know, putting on masks so they can't even really breathe.

They can't, in a court of law, you can't, you're like, you know, you can't speak if you've got a mask on, right?So like, you don't have any say.So when you put a mask on, you're basically taking away your power to speak and to breathe.So you're like a dead thing now.And then beyond that, we saw the hysteria that came with it, from fear, all that fear around you're infected, you might be infected, this person could be infected, you didn't get your shot, you better stay away, you can't come to the family gathering, you can't come into my establishment.And if you're in California, I mean, I left the state because it was like, I can get a fake vaccine card, but I don't wanna engage with people that are, mandating this, right?

What kind of hysteria, what kind of madness is this, right?So we've all experienced that kind of possession, not like some people personally experienced it and then said, wait a minute, I was in fear and I've woken up and others just saw it and saying, it's like everyone's possessed all of a sudden by this, you know, by this fear.

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Well, I mean masonry is based in the Old Testament, you know most a lot of the Masons I know are Christian, but again, it's I look at as an initiatory path, so I don't look at it as Masons are evil.What I experienced was that there's, okay, so I'll put it like this.The first night that I went there...Where was this?The Cornerstone Lodge in New York, which is a very famous lodge.People like Jay -Z go there and whatnot.

Jay -Z's a Mason?Yeah, from my understanding, he was with that lodge as well, but higher than I was.But the point is that It's an initiation that kind of what I felt wasbeing observed and watched.And I know it was watched because after doing the first degree initiation where you get the blindfold and the noose and all this stuff is online.I'm not revealing some secrets, all the phrases and things, the geometry of it where you have to walk certain directions and points and say certain things.

All that's online now, it's public.But when you perform it ritualistically like a play, there are other forces that are not human that are engaging in the experience.And I know that because when I was leaving the lodge that night with my friend, we got a phone call and it was an unknown number and this sort of husky voice was on the phone and he was like, how was the meeting?And I was like, it's interesting game you guys have going here.And it's like, and we were just talking a bit.saying a lot of things that were like biblical, you know, 40 days in the cave, 40, some stuff that I didn't understand.

But I knew that they were watching me because I was walking back to my apartment in New York.And I'm like, oh, so you're watching me?He's like, yeah.I'm like, okay, what am I doing?He's like, you're walking.So I stopped walking.

And I'm like, oh yeah?He's like, yeah, you stopped walking.And I was like, okay, it could be a guess, but let's just go, you know, continue the conversation, go upstairs.And I had like a gray shirt on and black pants.And after I started recording the conversation, the audio did not record subsequently, only the video recorded.But as I was recording, basically it was this man's voice and then it would be a woman that would take over.

So it was like two voices.One is a man, one is a woman.And then she basically said, stop recording.And I was like, you know, I didn't stop.I would maybe like stop for a minute, then I'd turn it back on.And I had a, at that time I had a cross on, sorry, it was not a cross, it was a Islamic sword that I had as a necklace.

And so I was taking my shirt off and she's like, put your shirt back on.And I was like, oh, you don't like this symbol or what's wrong?And it was like, put your shirt back on.And I'm like, you know, we just continued to talk, but there were a few things that I remember distinctly, including her saying, I'll leave you with this.You're wearing a gray shirt with black pants.So something had been observing me that night, and they continued to talk with me.

And it was essentially, they texted me thereafter.And it was like, it went on for an hour or so, like off and on.My friend who took me there got really sick to his stomach.He was like vomiting, actually, during that same time that I was on the phone.and he really was physically out of it.And so, I was conversing with these things for an hour.

And again, a lot of it was about the fallen angels because this goes back to, again, the jinn, the unseen world, the idea that–remember, the Book of Enoch talks about this–that the fall basically is not just Lucifer.It's like Lucifer and the 300, I think, that fell.But a lot of it had to do with the origin of like how the angels fell in love with human women, right?That's the story of Enoch, was that they fell in love with human women, they had children, the Nephilim, the fallen ones, or also I guess they're also fallen ones.And this wholebloodline war, basically, of like, you know, fallen angels having children with human women and becoming like the great leaders of old, you know, the men of renown, exactly.

The leaders of the military and the emperors or kings of the time.Royal bloodlines.So, all this came up that night.

What's interesting is if you bring up that story from Enoch, it's alluded to in Genesis 6 as well.People look at you like that's the craziest thing I've ever heard.Where does that come from?Is that like a David Icke concept or something?But then if you just assess it non -emotionally, that's pretty much every religion tells that story, including Christianity.Jesus is the product of spirit and a human woman, God and Mary.

So the Greek myths, Alexander was, his mother said that Zeus came to her.Exactly.

So I'm not, you know, I mean that's not proof, but it's certainly an indication this is not like a crazy new theory that David Icke thought up.Not at all.

And that's why I always say people...It's like the basis of every religion.Yeah, that's why people get so, they want you to think about Icke as like he's the crazy guy, but that's why I studied history because I wanted to say no, Icke is just picking up on old traditions and he's just listening to people that are telling him stories, which I think...

You can hear that story in any church in the United States every Sunday.Exactly.Right, so it's not...Conceptually, it's not a departure from what people have thought for thousands of years, that there is the physical reality of actors from the spiritual realm impregnating human women.

Right.right and going again i mean even the anunnaki texts of the sumerians before you know which predates the old testament talking about exactly this thing about the anunnaki sky gods um creating thefirst humans as their workers.And again, the flood mythology comes from that.

God was so displeased by the behavior of the Nephilim that he destroyed the world.And their behavior that he specifically called out was violence.

Right, right, and eating of, actually eating of humans, the Nephilim did, remember?Really?Oh yeah, the giants ate the humans, remember?that's in the book of Enoch.It's in one of them.It's either, I mean, I thought it was in the Bible, but it's definitely in Enoch then because that was the issue, that they were, that the giants were eating people.

And so this, you know, then takes us to the very, you know, present day of, you know, when demon, you know, the lore around demons drinking human blood or like, you know, demon possessed humans drinking human blood, Dracula mythology, right?I mean, this is all, it's, it's, it's drawn upon the old world, but it, you know, when I, When Hunter S. Thompson talks about adrenochrome, and people say, oh, he made that up, and I go, yeah, except I talked to a military intelligence guy who goes, adrenochrome's real, because it comes across our messaging boards all the time.Adrenochrome is being trafficked into the country.

So adrenochrome is a compound from the human adrenal gland, is that correct?

Yeah, I mean, my understanding is it's like an adrenaline, basically it's adrenaline that gets secreted from like, obviously, adrenaline from anxiety, from stress, fear, and it's, you know, it's something specifically that is being used for, you know, as a drug, or is it, you know, is it demonic food?I don't know.I mean, again, it's not something that I've personally experienced, but, you know, it's like we're connecting theseworld to the modern world.And it seems to be, if it's one long thread, we can't just ignore that.

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Visit defendcellcam .com, that's defendcellcam .com.It's very interesting to me that some of the main themes throughout human history, blood being the life force, the spirit.The magic in the blood, right?The magic in the blood, genetics, bloodline.

These were full -blown preoccupations for every civilization before 1945.And they've just been eliminated from public conversation by media.

but media is the greatest magician of all, right?I mean, that's, it's so interesting that you mentioned 45.obviously that's the end of the Second World War.You know, British broadcasting was originally part of British intelligence.Like it was always, they understood that propaganda was key.I mean, that was First World War effort, bringing us into the First World War, getting us, you know, getting us involved.

And then obviously the Second World War, the same, there was a huge amount of propaganda that was put out for it.But then we adopted those same techniques post -45, I would say.the various radio projects, you know, whether it was like, you know, and from radio to television, right, the same concept.A lot of the guys, as you know, that were like intelligence OSS officers or, you know, part of the OSS then became like executives and whatnot for the original, you know, TV channels, which as you know, at the time was like, what, like four?You know, it was like ABC, CBS, NBC, right?And so it was very, It was very important to send out messaging and then likewise with radio, it was the same thing.

It was like, okay, first radio was used, you know, for, for information before television, but then radio became the music.And so it became like top 40, what was it?The top 40 project that essentially was like, let's, let's figure out how to basically condition people using music and it's no longer going to be symphonic.right, like long symphonic pieces of music.It's going to be short, three minutes or less of something that can hook people.Cultural propaganda.

Culturally propagandize over and over, hypnotize people essentially.I mean, that's what music does.Think about when we engage with, it's so interesting engaging with young people now and seeing how much like, you know, when I was a kid, hip hop was, it was kind of coming, you know, it was coming on in the 90s.But nowadays it's like all those lyrics, a lot of the more debasing you know, lyrics, let's say.How do you end up with that?an only fans culture?

Well, it starts with the lyrics that are put out through hip -hop music that's propagated to every, you know, young kid across the country.And then that becomes part of the cultural conditioning, languaging, all these things.So, I think music is one of the most important magical tools that, you know, that's used to obviously influence culture and then obviously not just music and film and nowadays with streaming, it's putting people into hypnotic states for hours on end, right, when you stream things into their consciousness.

Yeah, or social media are hypnotic, I've noticed, and very addictive.

TikTok especially, I mean, people literally just fall asleep to it, you know, it's just scrolling and streaming.

So part of the point of the propaganda effort is not just to highlight lies, but to prevent people from considering things in full context or seeing the whole picture.Always.Eliminating certain important themes from the public conversation.And certainly, anything supernatural would fall into that.Blood and genetics would also be part of that.But the people who run the world never stopped paying attention to the supernatural, to blood and genetics, did they?

No, I don't think so.I mean, from my experience, and again, I mean, I have a limited experience of it, but you talk to some of these families, and I mean, first of all, in the UK, you feel it, especially in England, the aristocratic culture, the mindset.To this day, they still have a king, you know?Yes.Okay.You know, they still have the aristocracy and the bloodlines, families and whatnot, and their traditions.

And then, you know, you think about like, you know, some of these families talk about they can trace their ancestry back to the Roman Empire.even before sometimes.But again, it's just whether or not you're aware, again, like whether or not you're aware of it, I think some families more so than others.The families that are more aware of it, I think have a certain conditioning process that some people talk about when it comes to the pedophilia.I think that's more normalized, kind of part of the boarding school culture.Yeah, oftentimes, like that was my sense of it when I was at Oxford for two terms and, you know, hanging out with some people, some families that are more known than others.

And they would, you know, some of them would tell me like, you know, the boarding school culture was very, you could say, you know, homosexual.And that kind of dates back in terms of the ideology to Rome and Greece.Remember, like the idea of you know, passing on wisdom from the male, from the older male to the younger male.So it becomes acceptable.And then, yeah, and then, you know, you do hear these things about a lot of these families that are like practicing pedophilia with their own kids.And they look at it almost like a training, like a training process, because it dissociates.

So traumatic abuse of a young person dissociates them, makes them able to then you could argue like, you know, like the monarch butterfly, that's a symbol.The monarch is often described as a symbol of the childhood programming.So basically, when you are traumatized so young, you dissociate, you now have greater ability to act without moral compunction, without even like knowing your own limits, right?Your own self.You basically have broken all those barriers.

Well, you do have toquestions about a system that sends, you know, its sons to boarding school at seven or eight years old.Or even younger sometimes.Or even younger.Yeah, my grandfather went, you know, at that kind of age.And it wasn't good for him.

I don't know why you would do that, but it has something to do with breaking down normal qualities in a young man. I'm not saying it's a bad thing.pederasty thing, but it does have to do with...Yeah, abuse has many forms.

That's right.There's the physical, there's the verbal.The sexual is just usually like the one that no one wants to talk about.No, that's right.But obviously occurs.

So, okay, so you, how long were you a Mason?

I mean, it's not like you ever like established like, I'm going to meetings.No, I wanted to initiate to three degrees.I entered And in between, by the way.Okay, so this is why I know this gets far out, but like in between.We're already pretty far out.The initiation, the first degree and the third degree, in that time period, I would get phone calls from 666 numbers all the time.

666, 666, 666.We want your soul.Like just demonic voices.I want your soul.That's kind of nonsense.So Satan called your cell?

I mean, I don't know if it was Satan or the CIA, but someone with a 666 number that sounded satanic called my cell and would be like, we want your soul.And I would just laugh.I don't be like, okay, I mean, it's not mine to give, you know, my soul belongs to God.So I don't know what you're talking.I can't.I can't help you, basically.

I don't know what to tell you.

I think I'm jumpier than you because if I was in between degrees in the masons and Satan started calling me, I would drop out.

Well, it's not about dropping out or not.It's about initiating an understanding of the world.And that's why I believe the checkerboard is very real.The way that it's designed is the checkerboard on the floor.It's black and white.Not all Satanists are evil.

I do believe that there's a path of light and there's a path of dark.They wanna assess who you are.And as I say they, I mean like a higher realm wants to know what you are.So I believe that people that join and choose the darker side, I think I've seen it, they basically are willing to do anything.They're willing to drink the blood.They're willing to make the oath essentially to the dark because they just want power.

And if they know that you're not, your soul isn't wired that way, you don't end up on the satanic path.So again, like a lot of these were just kind of tests.I felt like they were just kind of tests, just kind of, like I got a call from a Zazel one time.You know, Zazel's the angel of death, right?A Zazel calls, and then like a day or two later, my grandmother passed away.One of my grandmother.

Wait, the angel of death called yourself?Yeah.Well, it was like, now, I mean, it basically identified itself as a Zazel.What did you say?No, I just, I knew what a Zazel was.So I knew a spirit of death was around.

And then, like I said, my grandmother passed, like, I think within one or two days of that call.So I was like, wow.Okay.

What did the angel of death say on the phone?

It wasn't, I don't remember, like, again, it wasn't like I remember specifically an announcement of something.It was just more of like, in that time period, it was getting so many calls from these things like wanting my soul and sometimes it was witches cackling.like, you know, come play with us, like, come, you know, come join us.Sometimes it was one time, and it's funny, I played this on Alex Jones' show, actually, back in 2012.It was a call from, again, 666, and they were doing ball worship.They were, like, calling on ball, and they were, like, it sounded like they were doing a ritual.

These demonic voices are, like, ball, la la, you know, they're doing a ritual on this, yeah, on the phone call.So it was almost like they were trying to, like,my energy for what they were doing.Do you see?That goes back to the question around the dark side wants more energy because, again, it's disconnected from God.Well, I mean, is it disconnected?

Let's just say.they're more disconnected.I don't think anything is disconnected from God.My perception is it's all God's universe.So I don't think the dark, I think the dark still ultimately serves the creator's intention.I don't think you can, you can't divorce yourself from the universe.

But let's just say their frequency is lower.So they're drawing upon higher vibrational energy to try to, right, to try to draw us down.That's the battle, right?It's like how many of those of the light can we bring to the dark?How many can we sink to our level?Or if we can't, They stopped after 2012, after my last degree of initiation, and after 2012, I never got calls again.

So I just felt like it was this kind of testing phase.And it's like, okay, you don't belong to us.Who knows?Maybe they've taken new forms and, you know, not saying everything like life is obviously full of challenges.So I think the dark can manifest in different ways.But for me, it was like, it was a very overt confrontation with something that people would think is, you know, a fairy tale until you've lived it.

Do you think other people at the Lodge, the Cornerstone Lodge in New York, were having similar experiences?

Well, I mean, I know the person I went with did, but like some of the other guys that I knew, I don't think they, anything changed in their life because, again, I mean, we all have different paths, right?We all, like, you know.My path was frankly initiatory.I wanted to explore these things.You know, I went all the way to Iran just to talk to, you know, guys that were talking to Jinns and trying to understand how the world, you know, is working.

What drove you?Yeah, just...Well, you grew up in a materialistic society.in Southern California where the possibility of this stuff was not discussed, I would think.

Well, no, I mean, I wasn't, you know, my dad took me to India and Tibet when I was, you know, nine, no, ten.And, you know, we went to the Himalayas and went to, like, visit, you know, Tibetan monasteries.We went to, what's that, the Patala Palace.And, you know, they depict demons and stuff very overtly in the iconography, right?the artwork, right, of Tibet, Nepal, the Buddhist cultures, and even Hindus, right?Like, you know, they understand that there's demons and angels and, well, they wouldn't call it angels, I guess, but like demigods, right?

I mean, they would describe like demigods, right?More, you know, angelic, more divine, powerful beings.And then you've seen like the dark faces of the demonic realm.They look at everything, I think, as like different temptation.So it's like, you have to get comfortable, you have to face the demon.You know, you can't, If you hide it, it gets scarier, just like in a horror film, right?

It's always scarier when you don't know where the monster is.Once you can face the monster, you take away its power.Or as, you know, as going back to the dream demon, the Freddy Krueger, it's like, you know, I take my power back.I'm not afraid of you anymore.That's the only way to defeat the monster.

I believe that, yeah.

Fear and hate also feed the demons.Yeah, well, and I'd made a whole film, Natural Born Killer, is kind of about this thing, you know?It's pretty interesting.I mean, That's a Boring Killer is if you watch it as two demon -possessed people, which is really what they are, the main characters.Mickey, you know, he's been abused by his father who kills himself.He's been physically abused by his father.

The Juliette Lewis character has been sexually abused by her father.And it's like all this kind of chaoticmedia, you know, glorification of these two serial killers, but they're going through their journey of hell, basically, like a hellscape, until they find that love kills the demon, right?That's their salvation is through love.But if you watch the movie, it's just like two demon -possessed people, it's pretty interesting.

Okay, so if we think that hate and fear feed dark forces, spiritual forces, Unconscious hate, I think there's healthy, we hate certain things that we find intolerable.

But if we hate the person, if we demonize the person, that's feeding the darkness.

Wanting to hurt other people, having malice toward others.Yeah, exactly.And then fear, being terrorized.If those are both spiritual foods for demons, how should we understand our government's concerted effort over many years to make us terrified and hateful.

Not just the government, media with it, right?Like media and government working hand in hand.

Right, I mean, those kind of are the messages, really.There's someone you need to be afraid of, and there's someone you should hate, you're required to hate.

Well, think about the nature of the Masonic lodges.There's the Red Lodge and the Blue Lodge.I don't know anything about that.Yeah, so that's the famous, like, there's the Blue Lodge, which is more like the French ancestry.The Scottish Rite is the Red Lodge.And so think about like the Bloods and Crips, the Democrats and the Republicans as red and blue.

Also the Bloods and the Crips, red and blue.And the Bloods and the Crips.So like this whole idea of, you know, but people articulate as two wings of the same bird, ultimately.It's like both are there to govern your mentality, government, govern your mind, right?So it's like, do we want, you know, do we want more laissez -faire?Well, the Republicans are supposed to be more libertarian, more conservative.

more like, you know, but they don't, but they tend to just, you know, end up spending as much as the blue team, you know, both obviously are just dependent on the same Federal Reserve System, right?So you could say like, we've been captured by the Federal, you know, by this debt slavery, this debt slave Federal Reserve System since 1913, which is again, right around the time that Well, as we know, the income tax came in, which, yeah, totally unconstitutional.And then also the First World War begins and the British bring us into their empire because, you know, more formally, because before that we were, you know, we were not supposed to be part of the European game.We were focused on, you know, the Monroe Doctrine was about, you know, focusing on our hemisphere, right?And bringing the Republic, you know, our Republic as a model, you know, for this region and protecting this region from the imperialists of Europe, be it, you know, French, British.I mean, remember during the Civil War, Mexico had a coup.

by the French and the British Empire actually cooed the Mexican government right around the same time.They were trying to install their puppet there.Didn't work out, but Mexico then, again, there's all kinds of puppeteering that goes on, as we know, through the different forces financially.So that's really, I think, the key is like America wanting to be a republic independent of the European empires.With the First World War, Wilson made a huge decision, which I think was a huge blunder.committing us to that war.

We should have been an arbiter.We should have said, you know, we're not in favor of either empire.We're going to just arbitrate, you know, a peace, a peace deal and should have stayed neutral, but we didn't.We committed ourselves to the British empire and thewe set up, obviously, as a result of that with the Versailles Treaty, you know, the...

Hurt so many people.

The Second World War followed, and we, you know, obviously, again, you can get into the whole history of the financiers behind, you know, Hitler and his rise to power, and so it was like, we're going to play, you know, Germany against, you know, the Soviets, who also got financial support from us.So it's...It became a financier's game, and that's why I say the power behind the scenes really to me is the financial empire, and the Rothschilds are obviously a part of that.I don't think they're the be -all, end -all of it, but they're a very important force financially.The City of London is a very important force, and the Federal Reserve System, which spawned from that central banking system of England.So that's when we talk about what's going on.

who's the American federal government serving?It's been serving the expansion of a debt slavery monetary system, right?Because we're borrowing money every time we, they're printing money, but they don't own it.It's not like, it's not constitutional money.And the constitution, gold and silver is constitutional money.Everything else is these paper notes or promissory notes.

That's why it's a Federal Reserve note when you see a dollar bill.It's a Federal Reserve note.It's a promissory note.Promise to pay.

Yeah.

Right?So it's all like, it's all debt.And we're just racking up, you know, as we know, but if we're at 38, 40 trillion, I don't know.Some unpayable amount.Doesn't matter.I mean, exactly.

It's, it's not going to be, you know, we have to reconfigure this.

But it raises a question.So if individuals can make a deal with supernatural forces to serve them in exchange for, for temporal power, for success in this life, money and authority, and that's clearly true, can nations do the same?

I think so.I think it's,it's it's a kind of well yeah I mean again it's like power of belief right as a nation and either So we can go back to John Dee, for example, in Achaean magic.

Who is John Dee?

So John Dee was, he was basically like the head of intelligence for Queen Elizabeth, right at the beginning of the British Empire.Elizabeth I. Elizabeth I, yeah, sorry.Go back in time to the 1580s.16th century, yeah.Yeah, exactly, the 1580s.And Dee is the original 007, that's how he signed his signature.

So Bond is actually inspired from John Dee.and he was into magic.He basically was working these, what they call the Nokian magic, because again, derived probably from the Book of Enoch, but he was communing with these beings, watchers, what he considered angels, and he had this, you know, these incantations.He was summoning spirits?He was working with spirits, and the theory is, basically the Shakespearean Tempest play is inspired from John Dee as the wizard in the story, is basically John Dee.he essentially made the deal for the British Empire to become the most powerful empire in the world.

And it begins with the sinking of the Spanish Armada, which again, as everyone knows, it was like, it was a freak, it was a massive storm.He got in a tempest.And a tempest that basically, you know, helped to sink that, their, their plans and their fleet.And yeah, the theory is that he basically made the deal to, you know, for the British Empire, but the deal requires a certain level of blood sacrifice.And, you know, some people say that we've inherited the British Empire.and those demons, essentially, those same deals.

I can't.

Especially since 45, since the end of the Second World War.

It is interesting if you think about it.So here you have this island nation with a pretty small population take over the entire world.A quarter of the planet was under there.Yeah, a quarter of the planet was under there.That's right.So, yeah, largest empire, some ways the most amazing empire.

but certainly a vast empire.How'd they do that?

Yeah, I mean, it's more than guns, germs, and steel, right?I mean, it's economically, the financial component is fascinating, you know, how they were able to obviously, you know, do it, you know, with the shipping and whatnot, insurance and shipping and, you know, they controlled, you know, when they controlled the seas of the Western world all the way to India, even China, right?They were able to control the seas and then they basically would trade, you know, they had a certain traffic where they would, you know, they would take the cotton, they would buy the cotton cheap from, you know, slave labor in America, sell it over, you know, sell it over and, you know, across their empire in India, buy the tea and the opium from there, from Afghanistan, which was under India at the time, and then dump the opium on the Chinese and get the silver for that.It's a pretty good trade, right?It's a pretty good deal.

But the core power, you believe, came from a deal.

Well, what I see the world as, it's a spiritual and a material reflection of each other.So what I believe is when people understand how these workings happen, it's like if you have an intention and you, let's say, undertake a magical working that has enough belief behind it, let's say, enough energy behind it,it can manifest in physical form.And this is the nature of magic.So to me there's always two paths with magic.See Christ says, thy will be done, which is the creator's will.

The magic of what I would say like the dark side is my will be done.And that's what like Sir Crowley and other people like this.Crowley said he was an incarnation, a reincarnation of the guy working with John Dee in the magical ceremony.So their mentality is love is under will.So basically like love is not the primordial power of creation for them.Individual ego will is more important than love.

Yeah, that's a dead end.

It's interesting because it points to something that I think all of us feel, which is that there's something dark about success.It can be.You know, there's that famous line, show me the fortune and I'll show you the crime.Yeah, Balzac.Yeah, Balzac is really, Reason enough to learn to read French.It's just an amazingly hilarious, insightful.

Peregorio is one of the great novels.Anyway, yeah, Balzac.Show me the fortune, I'll show you the crime.That resonates because, and it's not to attack all rich people, I mean, we're both, I guess, by some standards, rich people, but.

There's a whole other level.There's a whole, right.I mean, when you're, but again, you're talking dynastic people that have like, you know, made fortunes on, again, dump selling, selling opium to the Chinese and, you know, or selling slaves or selling weapons or, you know, financing wars like the Rothschilds.I mean, that's a level of crime, you know, and, or pimping, people like, you know, like Epstein, you know, types, you know, pimping girls and boys.That's a whole other level.

But that's kind of the nature of grand success in this world, isn't it?Yeah.I mean, that's maybe the reason that Jesus says it's harder for rich people.to get to heaven than a camel through the eye of a needle.There's something about it, and maybe that something is the deal that is inevitably made with satanic forces in order to get whatever that success is.

Is that a crazy hypothesis?You know how many people tell me, like, the Mexican cartels are doing straight black magic?They are.That's a fact.Right.And I mean, imagine, like, these are people that are trafficking humans, they're trafficking, you know, drugs, they're killing, they're cutting off heads, they're killing with impunity.

I mean...

And not just killing, but torturing.So that, to me, is always a sign that there's something religious going on.So you torture others for one of two reasons, either to elicit information, you know, I'm going to waterboard you, tell me where the terrorists are.

Which unfortunately, as we know, is not necessarily accurate information.

No, no, it's not, it's not.But like, okay, but as a motive.

Yeah.

Or you're doing it for its own sake, because there's something about human suffering that brings you power.And that's And when we touch, and pleasure, and maybe adrenochrome.That's when we are bumping up against the supernatural realm, right?Because why would you, if you're gonna kill somebody, why would you torture them first?But they always do.

But see, I would posit it more that when are we not in the supernatural?See, I think that's the shift in consciousness that is required.the great awakening is that we're, you know, people have talked about, especially since COVID is like.

Oh no, we're having one, there's no doubt.

We are always under the eyes, like we are always living a supernatural experience.We just, we haven't thought that way.We've been trained to think of it as a material existence.Yes.And the shift now is to say, no, it's, everything we do has supernatural ramification because it's always choice between serving, you know, again, serving,higher self, let's call it, and serving ego.

That's, to me, like, that's the eternal battle.Every choice we make, every, and you know, small decisions, big decisions, all this, it all counts.And obviously small decisions probably won't have the greater impact than a bigger decision will, but if we can shift our consciousness to start realizing how I behave at every moment, is it aligned with my higher version of self or not, this is what we have to do.do to achieve a better world.If we wanna shift into a better reality, then that falls upon us to say, am I following my heart?Am I listening to my heart?

Am I listening to intuition?Am I being moral and good in this moment?And I don't think that's the whole point.None of us are perfect, but the whole point of the Christ model is it's a model for us.This is the way of perfection.Listen to the words, try to imitate the Christ, and I think we would have a much healthier reality.

Yeah, I mean, Jesus is really clear that every word you utter, every word will be used to judge you.Like every word matters.Exactly.It's all life force.

It begins with thought.That's why, like even the Buddhists, you know, the ancient religions, they always write thought, work on your thoughts to then correct your speech, to then, you know, change your actions.So it all builds.It's in that exact same passage where he says, you know, the evil heart produces evil actions.

Yeah.No, it's so right.So that brings us to the United States, which is the heir to the British Empire.So if the British Empire was the product of this deal that John Dee made to bring the Tempest to destroy the Spanish Armada, launch Britain into control of the West, and then that control ends in 1945 with the dropping of the atom bombs on roughlyspeaking.So where does that put the United States government?

I mean, we've been subsumed by the new world order ideology and for a long time.Now the new world order ideology came out of the British empire.It wasn't a conspiracy theory.It was their own language.Cause I went back when I was doing my history thesis at college and I was like reading some of the minutes of these conferences and they kept saying new world order.It was their own language.

they wanted to basically continue the empire and in a more informal way, because they realized the empire was, you know, it was getting a lot of flack, right?They couldn't sustain it militarily.They didn't have the manpower.They wanted to bring America in.Clearly, they meant Cecil Rhodes, who was, you know, the great imperialist of South Africa, Rhodesia, getting the diamond mines set up and the gold mines and whatnot.and his benefactor was Lord Rothschild and he, you know, Rhodes was in his will saying we want to reclaim the Holy Lands and we want to bring America back basically within the empire.

So that was the agenda from the end of the 19th century, bringing America to be like the military might of the Western financial system, right?That takes place clearly between World War I and World War II.As you said, we then take over for the British Empire, all of its former colonies, and the French colonies, including Vietnam.You know, why do we end up in Vietnam more?It's a French colony.

Indochina, yeah.

Yeah, Indochina.Why do we, you know, take on Turkey and Greece, you know, to defend against the Soviets?That's all the British imperial realm.The Middle East, Again, the French and British carved up the Middle East.All these countries are essentially, you know, creations of the British and the French.So, we inherit that.

empire and basically ally with this idea of, you know, the world game.Russia had been the enemy of the British, they became our enemy.And that's a whole complicated issue, but essentially, you know, partly it's, it's dynastic families, you know, wanting the wealth of the others.And that's perhaps why they, they could, um, uh, bizarre, you know, to get their, their fortune and get them out of power and put the Soviets in partly as an experiment, partly as a way to keep the Russia out of, I don't know, I guess you could say like, um, separated from the Western world to create like an enemy going forward.Cause as we know, We backed Hitler at the beginning to go against Russia.That was the whole deal.

It was like, you're going to fight the Russians kind of like we backed Iraq to fight the Iranians in the 80s.You know, it's the old divide and conquer technique.So yeah, so Russia had been the British enemy.We inherited that.And then we basically bought into the new world order ideology.That's why we kept going into this globalist mentality for decades, you know, of committing ourselves.

But there's a supernatural element too.It seems obvious.It was only in the last year, after a lifetime of living next to it, that I realized the Pentagon is the shape of a pentagram.Yes.Yes.Why of all potential architectural designs would you put your headquarter, your military in a pentagram?

Again, the stars that soldiers wear, it's like, as you know, like if you've seen movies or whatnot, like the pentagram or pentagon pentagram is a very common image for can be for protection.There's an invocation of protection through it.And then there's also the inverted pentagram which is oftentimes used for sacrifice.Like you'llit in films, right?Where they'll put the pentagram on the floor and within a circle, and then they'll do a ritual sacrifice within it.

Yeah, well, it's the central image of Satanism.

Yeah, exactly.The inverted horns, right?It's like the horns, it's the inversion of the pentagram.So again, it can be used either way.

We're a little dull on symbolism, I notice, in our culture for some reason.

People are waking up.

But it's, we went through this period where, you know, for all of history, symbols really matter.

Yeah.

They really matter.Yeah.In a lot of world, they still matter.And then in the West, for the last 80 years, symbols are just null and void.

Yeah.

Like, your average person is not allowed to notice the symbolism in anything.

Yeah.Yeah.No, we have to.

Poetry dies, metaphor dies.Exactly.Spiritual life withers, and we just don't notice that.Our military is headquartered in a building called the Pentagon.And by the way, I learned this from you at breakfast this morning, I have no idea what it means, but I was amazed to learn that the cornerstone of the Pentagon was laid on September 11th, 1941, 60 years to the day that the flight was, Flight 77, I think, was flown into it.

77 is a magical number, too.You know, again, I think of these events as mass rituals.

I mean, look, I just learned this this morning eating my omelet, so I haven't thought about it at all, but that's kind of the point I'm making.I heard that plane.I was close enough to hear the plane or whatever.I heard that impact of something.Well, we never saw the video, right?

I'm aware.I'm aware.

The whole thing is bizarre, but I'm only making the point that I was very aware that it happened.I had a friend on that plane, et cetera, et cetera.Why am I now, 25 years later, for the first time learning that the Pentagon cornerstone was laid on September 11, 1941?Like you'd think in the coverage of it, they'd be like, hey, this is kind of...

Yeah, the 60th anniversary, you'd think so, right?I never heard that.Did you know that?Yeah, I'd read about it, but I don't even think I'd read it.No, but at the time, was that like on World News Tonight?At the time, I mean, I was as clueless at the time when it happened.

I just thought, look, all I knew about 9 -11 was that nothing made sense because I was in Somaliland in the summer, in July, and we got, notices from the State Department, faxed saying, you know, be careful to all foreign, you know, all nationals, all American nationals abroad.Um, like there's basically like rumor around like a terrorist plot.So be like, be a high alert.

I was in Maine that summer and they didn't send us any notice at all.

I know.I guess I should have been in Somaliland.So, so I mean, we already were like, kind of was like, Oh, it's interesting that we got the notice.that obviously something's coming across Intel's channels to say that.And I'm not sure if anyone ever reported on that in the investigation of the intelligence labs.But again, I never believed the official story.

And the more I looked at it, the more it just didn't add up.The takedown of the towers by, I mean, just structurally speaking.You know that the plane hit the Empire State Building back in 46?Remember that?

Yeah, of course.

It was a military plane at the time.It was a bomber.Bomber.And it collapsed.

Well, Donald Trump is on tape on the morning of 9 -11 saying, I can't, I don't know, how could that have happened?I know those buildings well.I was there when they were built in the early 70s, and the steel in those things is stronger than in any building in New York, and there's no way.

But now you think about the nature of ritual, and what was created was a holocaust, which is literally a mass burial.And this is, I don't know if you remember the movie called Wicker Man?No.Wicker Man, it was kind of a film about these pagan Satanists, you know, who they do a ritual around one of the equinoxes.I think it was like a summer equinox.And they do like a, they have this guy in this town realizing that these guys are witches.

And all of a sudden he finds himself inside of this mass of wicker man being burned alive.And it's played out every summer, by the way, in a festival called Burning Man here in Nevada, I guess, right, in the desert.The Burning Man ritual, the burning of the man annually.So, I mean, this again, these are ritual things that people partake in without understanding what they're giving their energy to.

That's right, that's exactly right.So, I mean, up until the Second World War, it would have been obvious to every Western man that life revolves around ritual and that ritual Describes to us concepts that our brains are not capable of fully grasping.

Mm -hmm.

You know the communion in Christianity It's like yeah, there's a great debate over exactly what that is But it's the center to the practice of the religion and it doesn't make any sense from a scientific point of view You're ingesting the flesh and blood of Jesus like what but to Christians Again, it's it's the Holy Eucharist.Mm -hmm and that makes sense to people because there's no other way to describe the things that are of this life, they're that profound.But our understanding of how central ritual is to life has just been stripped from us completely, so we totally miss it.We don't even know that the Pentagon gets hit on the 60th anniversary of the beginning of its construction.That's so bogus.

Well, you think about the nature of, well, first of all, like television.has, a lot of it has like disrupted like ritual cycles and whatnot, like the cycles of our, you know, of our energy of going down with the sunset, like, you know, coming in, sitting around the hearth, telling stories, listening to the spirit, to the, again, being more connected to the spiritual world.Now the spiritual world does come in through television.It's just not the way we imagine it because we think this is like something different, but it's all going into our psyche.And so the, as you know, the brain, it's processing it the same, how do you say, it's processing and taking this information just as it would reality.So it's definitely affecting the way we interface with reality.

And again, this goes back to what we talked about, the power of the magic of media.And I think people that are storytelling, they can be, some are practicing darkness, I think others are practicing light, and I think there's those that are just unaware, unconsciously perpetuating things.But there doesn't be something very dark in Hollywood.And it's like a subversion.

You grew up there.So did you sense that?

What I sense with Hollywood is there's definitely more, like there's definitely, let's be clear, there's definitely a Babylonian quality to it.Right?There's definitely a debauchery.There's debauchery.I mean, you know, it's like everyone knew Harvey Weinstein.was a monster.

Not just with women, he was a monster with business.I knew him, I knew that.Right?I mean, everyone knew that.But he was just accepted.And it's just kind of like the casting couch, it's just like, oh, it's just accepted, this is the guy.

are.You know, the Epstein, I'm sure people, you know, I'm sure a lot of people knew what Epstein was.I never heard about him before, you know, before 20 whatever, 16, 17, 18, in that timeframe.But like, I'm sure a lot of people that were around him just knew like, oh yeah, you know, he's into this or he's into that because people talk, right?But it's amazing how, unless you're part of those circles, you don't really know what's going on.And that's why to this day, people will say, well, JFK, the assassination, they couldn't have kept the secret.

And I'm like, people in the know have talked, but you're just not in the know because it hasn't been perpetuated through media.So unless it gets perpetuated through media, we don't hear about it, and we don't think it exists.

Yeah, I mean, you just said the truest thing that I didn't understand until later in life, even though I spent my whole life in the media, the idea that if it's more than two people, no one can keep a secret.Well, none of these secrets have been kept.They're all out there.I've heard a lot of this stuff a million times, I just discounted it, and it was not part of the prevailing story we were told, so I just didn't think it was real.

Not Cardi B, what's her name, one of these rappers just came out talking about all this stuff in the Epstein, they're eating, she said in the music industry, they're eating babies and drinking blood.Which rapper was it?Was it Cardi?I don't know.Every week there's a new rapper.

But no one takes them seriously because they're rappers.

Yeah, exactly.But she said something to this effect.And you know, like Mariah Carey's sister said when she was a kid, she grew up, she talked about it before she died, Mariah Carey's sister.And it's in the Best Kept Secret docuseries that I put out.But basically she said like she grew up with things that were like done that were, you know, indescribably horrible, you know, like you can't fathom.And she died like a few years after that.

She came out saying it.People will sometimes come out and say things, and it'll be like a blip.And I think this is, my way of thinking is more like, if in the middle of the night, I see something fly across the sky, which I've done, like driving in Beverly Hills, driving home at like two in the morning, I saw like a craft, you know, fly overhead.Not so fast, it was more like a, it was almost, I don't wanna say like, it almost would be like an advanced version of a stealth bomber.It wasn't a stealth bomber, but it was like a craft that was moving very fast, low to the ground, right over Beverly Hills.So I look at that and go, okay, I've just glimpsed reality.

Someone else might go, that's just crazy.I'm just going to ignore that.So to me, I'm like, okay, this is what's really going on.I want to look over here now.And that's just the way that I see things.And other people will just be like, I once saw a UFO, but you know what?

That's just so crazy.I'm just going to go back to the mundane world.That's exactly right.

That's exactly right.But big picture, if people are trying to understand, not simply are they eating babies, but why would someone do something like that?Yeah, well.You get to the nature of the deal that every person faces, I think, the potential, which is the same as the temptation of Jesus.Bow down before me and all this will be yours.Yeah.

But in exchange for whatever you're getting, bloodshed.Yeah.Is the cost.Yeah.

Because the gravity, it's like, You know, once you've, once you've, it's like the dog that's like tasted blood, right?It's the, you know, you can't go back.You've, you've crossed a threshold.You've crossed a barrier that we're not supposed to cross, right?Thou shall not kill.Okay, well, if you do, you're probably gonna have remorse.

If you do it just, you know, especially just for defense purposes, you're still probably gonna have some level of remorse.I know sociopaths don't.

No, that's right.

So there's like a whole other caliber of psychology and maybe demon possession there.But as humans, we would have remorse.But once you've gone back, you can't take that back, can you?Like you've stained your soul.That's something that you can't, you know, you can steal something and make amends.You can, you know, you can, all crime is theft, but there's different degrees of theft, right?

you can steal people's time, you can steal their energy, you can steal belongings, but if you steal life, there's no, how do you return that?There's no restitution.

I'm extrapolating out to the, you know, to the scale of empire here and trying to understand why empires tend to commit themselves to war even when they don't get anything out of it.

And I'm...Someone's getting out of it.I mean...

I just wonder though if like the cost of staying on top isn't killing people just by its nature.

Yeah.Well, and again, I mean, different arguments.I mean, you go back to, like, what was the point of Vietnam?You know, if Vietnam fell to the communists, like, what the heck does that have to do with anything?

What's the point of the Russia -Ukraine war?Why would you want to keep that going?The only thing that you're getting out of that is, you know, weapons testing and money transfers and all that stuff, but ultimately what you're getting is millions of dead people.

Yes, blood sacrifice.

Maybe that's the point.Maybe it is blood sacrifice.

Right, right, to a degree.I think that's, you know, from a higher perspective, there does seem to be truth to that.And I think, look, this is a realm of mind, right?We've, since the fall of Adam and Eve, we fell into mind.So before this, there was order, there was perfect, it was perfectly guided, let's say, and then we fell.The story's not just Adam and Eve, it's Atlantis, it's all these things, right?

They fell into the mind.

What does that mean, the mind?

Everything we experience is the mind.We don't know anything outside of our own minds.So before the fall, we existed.Well, we didn't have.Well, I mean, presumably, if we trusted like the Lord basically just had perfected and ordered everything, We didn't have choice, we didn't have free will, we didn't have mind, we didn't have anything to mirror.We saw ourselves for the first time.

The mind is like a mirror, self -awareness.I am separate from you.Before that, it was just oneness, right?It was just, you knew you were, you could be.I mean, it's kind of like an angelic order, let's say.I mean, again, we're making assumptions here, but essentially what we know is that with self -awareness comes this idea of separation.

And so we are in a realm of mind where everything gets mirrored in some way.Every thought has to manifest.

With self -awareness comes separation, that is.

Yeah, the illusion of separation.I mean, ultimately, I believe that we're all from the same oneness and I believe it's God's universe.So there's really nothing to be afraid of, right?Because we're all, you know, if we choose, we can go, we can, you know, ascend higher, we can go back to the light.But there's no, the illusion of separation is that, it's just an illusion.Our ego feels separate.

Our ego feels like, you know, I'm me, this is my body, this is my name, this is what I've done.So that's why I say it's a battle between ego and higher self.Higher self is like, no, we're just instruments of the creator.I can let go of ego now.I don't have to feel like anything belongs to me.Anything I do is, you know, not mine.

You know, glory to the creator.We're just instruments here.We're just playing our roles.And, you know, hopefully there's no,is, well, I believe this is all for our evolution and understanding and recognizing, hopefully developing more empathy, more compassion, more love.That should be, I think, our goal on this planet.

But yeah, in the realm of mind, mind has to go somewhere.So if I have hateful thoughts, it has to go somewhere.So project, how does it, as we know, if I have hateful thoughts or angry thoughts, It's gonna be the way I treat my children, my loved ones, my family, my friends.It's gonna go somewhere.It's gonna go into war.It's gonna manifest somewhere, right?

And that's where we are still.We're in a place of strong polarity, right?Everything is being, you know, as light as it is, as dark as it is in this realm.So it has, like, the energy has to go into war until we clean up our thoughts and stop hating each other.Until then, we're gonna have war.

But there's also a sense in which bloodshed, war, violence, killing is the food that keeps the dark energy.

Yeah.But it starts with us.It starts with us.Like every, like, that's the whole, that's the, that's why I just say, like, the good news is they don't have any power unless we give it to them.If we give them power, if we give them attention, if we give them energy, if we feed them our fear, that's what Christ was saying.Let, you know, let go of the fear.

Just have faith.Let faith replace the fear.And that was what I had to go through in my you know, two, three year journey of like having these dark experiences and like being haunted by things that were like energetically tangible, my reality was like, okay, I surrender.Like I surrender to the higher power.I have faith.So you can't have my soul because it doesn't belong to you.

And I think that's the point, is if every one of us just, in our own lives, takes inventory, okay, we have fears, it's natural, some fears are deep, right, and paranoid, others are just existential, like there's a predator, there's a threat, okay?But if we can face our fears, own our fears, and find deeper faith, we will create a better reality, because the dark will have less food.It's our choice.

some social media are designed to inspire fear and hate?Of course.

Because again, it's just, it's being perpetuated through, through people that are unconscious.I would say like the, I don't think there's that many like dark sorcerers in the world.I think there are a few, I think there are definitely some people that, that commune and know what they're doing, you know, like ritualistically.But I think most people are just unconscious and they're just seeking worldly delight, worldly temptation, worldly power.yes right and they're just unconsciously not sure why but they're just like well that seems safe you know i don't want to lose my i don't want to lose what i have i don't want to you know i want to maintain and preserve but you can't this world is ephemeral it's passing right we know this um it's the way it's designed we're supposed to be able to let go and again commune with a higher power, and that's the greater energy, and that actually is what really preserves you.That's when you get to that place of, you know, with the saints and people that can glow and that can actually emit light, right?

You know, all these examples of what Christ is.This is where we're supposed to imitate, is to try to bring more light into the world.And so if we're not, how do you say, if people are not there but they're putting out these things, they're just reflecting themselves.So a lot of these, going back to Hollywood, like a lot of these creators are just, that's the level that they're at.Their consciousness is at that level.Their consciousness is full of, you know, their mind is full of, you name it, perversion, negativity, angst, fear.

So they're perpetuating that.They're not coming from a higher modality.They're not coming from a higher place.That's just, they can only reflect what they are.

Do you think it's more obvious in Hollywood than in other places?

Power centers, I mean there's a lot of power centers.London is a power center, Hollywood's a power center, New York's a power center.I mean every city is like a hub because how much energy gets, how do you say it, there's so many more people there, there's much more attention, but obviously Hollywood is this magnifier of consciousness.And so I think that wherever the consciousness goes, even collectively you could say, Hollywood shifts accordingly.I don't think Hollywood itself It's like they're sitting there going like, this is the way it is.It's like they're a barometer of where consciousness is.

And so it's, how do you explain it?It's almost like reflecting each other.They put out darkness, people want that, they feed into it.That's where the collective is.The collective wants to experience this.They want to go into darkness.

They want to go into experience the darkness.Okay, when you get to a certain point, you wake up.You say, I'm tired of the nightmare.And I think that's where we are.That's what the awakening means.It's like people saying, okay, you know what, enough of the nightmare.

Let's let's let's change the story and people rejecting Hollywood accordingly and saying, yeah, unless you guys shift the narratives, we're not going to watch your content anymore.The more we shift, the more Hollywood will shift.So it's it's it's a dance.Hollywood can't cannot survive without the audience.You cannot, you know, drug dealers can't.survive without the drug addicts.

We collectively have to shift our consciousness and everything will change.

I believe that.I notice it with AI.Most people, including I think the people who are creating AI, aren't really exactly sure what it's going to be, what the effects are going to be, but the only publicity about AI that's coming out of the developers of AI is negative and terrifying.There's been, I've noticed since this for the last three or four years, there's been no real effort to explain to you or me or anyone how this is going to be great for us.And a lot of effort put into telling us this is going to end everything that we love, including human autonomy, our jobs, our economy.It'll basically be a slave state run by machines.

That's what they're telling us.The people who are making it are telling us that.And so my instinct is they're trying to terrify us for some reason, and it may just be because that feeds the dark spiritual powers that are creating it.

Yeah, I think AI is just like everything.It's just both dark and light.It's like the internet, right?You can find the darkest things out there.You can find great information, right?You can find the books of the world if you wanna read them.

And it's just gonna be a question of where human consciousness will take it.Again, I believe that, again, because this is God's universe, I do have a more positive view of where all this is going.Post 9 -11 was a dark, I could feel the darkness, man. I could feel it before 9 -11.I could feel war coming from about 2000, the year 2000, 2001.I was like, feel like I could feel the energy of war and the darkness of the 2000s.I felt like war on terror was literally terror.

It was, it was about terror.It was about terrorizing everybody.You know, it was literally like terrorizing them.American public.It was a war of terror.Exactly.

It was terror for everybody, the American public, the broad.So that era was like, you know, this shift in consciousness was, you know, again, it was a pretty dark phase.I think now we are almost like operating in different realities simultaneously.which is kinda cool, you know?And I think it's almost, I feel more like, choose your adventure.What do you wanna do with technology?

What do you wanna do with the world that you're in?And just trust that this is all for our evolution as souls, to basically be reminded of the light, to return to the light ultimately, to reascend, I hope, in time.I think that would be the goal, right?Is to return to a state of more closeness to God.But you have to be separated to want to go back, right?

A lot of people are looking forward to going back right now, all of a sudden.So we're told that there's going to be some kind of disclosure about UAPs, UFOs by the federal government.What are UFOs?

So I think we have reverse engineered technology.that's been talked about for a long time.Certainly like Roswell's a famous incident.From what my understanding of it, something did crash and there was a huge military response and then, you know, the idea of a weather balloon and then they changed the story twice.It was originally like a weather balloon and then it was like some other thing.They basically, the guy that was there initially, I can't remember the name, he was a military intel guy, he took it back to like his family like a piece of the metal and it was it was like very strong but at the same time it was like you could actually like slightly bend it but it would go

back and it was unlike any metal they'd ever seen.So this was described by him and then his son, but he was basically forced to take the photo, the famous photo.I think his name was Marcel, like he had the famous photo of like holding the weather balloon.And to say like it was just the weather balloon and like he basically was forced to take that picture.I think since that time, we've been reverse engineering.I've talked to way too many people who are part of black programs or, you know, I've seen, you know, we have a secret space program.

The US Space Force is older than, than Trump.Like they basically brought it from like the hidden to the more public side now.But for example, I talked to Dr. Fred Bell.Do you remember, do you know him at all?Fred Bell was a very famous guy in the UFO community because he had worked with the government and he was also writing books about like alien technology and consciousness and things like this, quantum physics, brilliant guy.So we interviewed him for Conspiracy Theory, the show I used to do with Jesse Ventura.

And he was talking about mind war, like using frequency for like, you know, affecting people's thoughts and being able to affect people at a distance, right, through various technologies.But off the record, he was like, I shouldn't tell you guys this because my CIA, my CIA handler would not be happy with me, but I've been to the one like some of these underground military facilities.And he's like, I've even met what you would call like a gray alien.Like he's like, I shook hands with one, you know, he's like, they're, you know, they're down there, like in these facilities, we have these, these joint partnerships.Within 24 hours of that conversation, off the record, he was dead.He died in his hotel room.

before he could leave Minnesota, where he was...

After your interview.During the interview, yeah.

He died of a heart attack.

A lot of people involved in the space program in a kind of spooky science connected to the federal government have died or disappeared recently.

Yeah.

Like a lot.

It's like 11 that they've confirmed missing or dead.

Yeah, it seems like a lot.

Yeah, from everything from like fusion programs to NASA scientists, certainly in the age of disclosure, which we've been living through the last few years, it's more curious.At first, I thought people were saying like they were suspecting the Chinese, but do you remember, look, I mean, we still never got an answer to those drones.No, over New Jersey?Last year, they were all over, not just Jersey, they were all over like from Eastern seaboard, right?Virginia, I mean, multiple states, I mean, you get this kind of stuff.all the time, you know, these anomalies.

I actually asked about that, um, because Trump was going to disclose what it was, remember, during the campaign.He said, I'm going to get to the bottom of this.And, and then he said, ah, it's not a big deal.And I asked, you know, well, I got a, it's not a big deal.Epstein, Epstein's not a big deal.But what were those?

Listen, I, I look at this world.I mean, you ever see those paintings, some of those old paintings and you see like these little drone looking things in them.I just look at this world like we are being observed, you know, the watchers.They're, again, dark and light.They're observing this experiment of the fall, right?We've fallen, but God is always watching, God's permitting.

And, you know, there's beings that are interested in our genetics, that's for sure.The eugenics thing is ancient.Why are, eugenics is ancient?Well, we talked about it, like the idea of,creating humans, some of which were of royal bloodline or from deities and others are just more like workers.I think it's ancient.

I mean, isn't it curious, like the different races, you know, where do we, do we all just come from one race and we become like darker skin lighter?Or are we actually like different bloodlines, right?They're different blood types.so is it just evolutionary or is there something else going on in terms of, I think genetics connects to consciousness because, as we know, the eugenics interest, it's extreme.I mean, by the way, we gave birth to Hitler because the eugenics conferences were here first.They were British and American eugenics conferences.

And a lot of them, yeah, were racist, absolutely.But the interest in the idea that consciousness, as we talked about, the brain is a receiver then of course different genetics are gonna receive information differently.The body, how we experience reality is through this body.So isn't it, if we believe in souls and the journey that we go through in our life, our body is very connected to that experience.So of course there's a fascination with how much is a contingent on our genetic makeup and our propensities, for example.

For about 50 years in the United States, basically not allowed for people to mention any of this in public because it was Hitler stuff or whatever they said about it.

They changed the name.They called it, they changed it from eugenics to, what's the Cold Spring Harbor?They're doing at Cold Spring Harbor basically the same research.It's just genetic, what's the term for it?Anyway, it's just they called it genetic research now and likeyou know, they research.

Biotech, I think we call it.

Yeah, biotech and things like this, but it's the same principles.Maybe not based on the same racism, but some of it's, I'm sure, some of these people are still racist, like Epstein, who called everybody goy that wasn't Jewish.I mean, some of these guys are still racist.But yeah, I mean, they just changed the name.

It's just interesting that even as the, public has been absolutely banned from talking about this stuff.The people in charge are very fixated on genetics.Yeah, that doesn't surprise you.

Why should it?I mean, again, if this vehicle, it's pretty interesting technology.I mean, the body is incredible technology.That's what freaked me out so much during COVID was like the whole mRNA delivery system, right, that they were trying to inject us with.And as a lot of people were warning, that mRNA technology can start to affect your genome and might be passed on to your children.

I think that's been confirmed now.

Right.So pretty, pretty scary stuff that they were just mass injecting.

Into hundreds of millions of people, but then, and now we know that it can affect your DNA.I think that's beyond dispute, but I haven't read any followup and like, okay, what you're changing human beings generationally, what are the likely effects of this?

And that's, that's the transhuman, agenda.So transhumanism, you could say, is the evolution of eugenics to the place where a lot of these elites want to biologically re -engineer the human and arguably they want to get us to a place where they can merge us with the AI, the machine consciousness, to make us, well, you could say like an HG Wells type of scenario, right?You have the eliteand some of whom love, you know, the idea of like Elon Musk, you know, connect me to the machine, connect me to the computer so that I can be smarter, right? AndAnd then, you know, arguably those that are, you know, more mundane will either not have the ability or they'll be connected in a way that they can be more readily controlled.Is this what we're going towards?

You know, a cyborg type of future?Seems clear, right?It's certainly feasible, I don't think, in the next five years, but probably 20, 30 years and beyond, you could see a whole new humanity.

What do you think the point of the COVID exercise was?

Multilayered.They wanted, I mean, it seems that they wanted to shut down the world and print money en masse.They didn't have a war to do it, right?Without a great war, they needed some kind of conflict.This exercise was a way of, I think, testing consciousness to see how pliable and compliant people are.And obviously it was, like I said, frightening just to see your friends and neighbors just becoming like the Borg in Star Trek.

Just obey, wear your mask, do not question.If you question, you're crazy, you're dangerous.At some point they were talking about moving people to concentration camps, for quarantine camps.They were talking about digital tracking.I don't think they achieved fully what they could have, or if the dark side had won, let's say, prevailed.We could have, are you kidding me?

We could have been, what Chomsky said, those of us that were un -vaxxed, we could have been pushed out of society.They could have created a total digital verification of how many shots you've had and if you obeyed or not.I mean, the social credit system of a communist society, they could have gone all the way.I don't think they could have.that battle, but I think it was a big test to see where our human consciousness was.

I noticed you didn't mention public health as one of the reasons for that campaign.

Shifting our... in which aspect?

Well, the inherent threat of the virus, that didn't play any role in this.

The virus was perfect virus insofar as it was very contagious, and I think we all got exposed to it, and I think the virus does have long -term that we should work to clean out, but things like ivermectin and other can help us with cleaning that out of our system.But it wasn't like a particularly deadly virus.No, I mean, just look at the numbers.It was deadly with, if you had two plus comorbidities and you were over 70 years old, yeah, that was dangerous.But anyone who was paying attention, we knew about ivermectin, we knew about hydroxychloroquine, vitamin C, zinc, I mean, just health protocols, being in the sun, fresh air.all the things you would normally think would be healthy, you know, keeping your weight normal.

So last question, so many things are happening at once right now.One thing I've noticed during this conversation is you seem completely unsurprised, nonplussed by all these crazy things going on because you've just seen the world through this vantage for so long that it doesn't surprise you, is that fair?

Yeah, I think that when you've grown up seeing conspiracy reality, which I saw since I was like six, seven years old and my dad made JFK, I don't try to assume anything because I'm not in a position of one of the elites that's apparently making these types of decisions, right?So.

But you see a UFO and you say, I'm looking not at an anomaly, but at reality.Yes.Yeah.So that's a different way of looking at the world.So, um, and probably a better one, but given that worldview, you see now the unresolved war in Ukraine, this new war in Iran, which seems like it is already a global war.Who knows the promise of UAP disclosure, the rise of these, terrifying dystopian technologies, mass surveillance, AI, all happening in like a five -year span.

What is all of this?They're clearly connected phenomena.They're definitely connected phenomena.Any one of these things would have been enough to like fry my 30 -year -old brain if these had happened in 1999.

I guess it was, well, look, the NATO war against Serbia was pretty, it was relatively isolated, but that region of the Balkans, but that region was devastated by that era.I keep emphasizing to people, look, the world ended many times already.I think if we lived through World War II, can you imagine the devastation of that time period?I mean, maybe 100 million dead, the entire world engaged at some level of the conflict.I think that we can't really, we have to get back to primary principles of, okay, is it really as bad as the mind might want it to believe?And the fear wants us to believe.

So I don't like to give into those fear narratives.I truly believe that the light is prevailing.People are waking up.Every time something happens,know, is occurring, we're in a time now where it's like, thanks to the social media component, as much as we can say like, yeah, there's banal things, there's like degrading things, there's things that maybe like take us out of ourselves or into our lower self, there's also so much revelation coming at the same time, right?So we can have these conversations now that Listen, I couldn't talk about the pedophilia, cannibalism stuff back in the 2000s when I first found out about it.

Because, you know, I was reading about the Franklin scandal and the Franklin cover -up and things like this, right?This was back in the 80s and 90s that they were, you know, the trafficking ring.I remember, yeah.Right, and Franklin, and it had to do with Larry King, who was very high up in the Republican National Committee.You know, stories like this that I know about.

A different Larry King.

Yeah, a different Larry King, exactly.The black Larry King, not the CNN Larry King.And, you know, I couldn't talk about these things publicly, but gradually I've seen consciousness awakening.My journey has been so interesting in that regard.Like, I was doing conspiracy theory with Jesse Ventura back when it was shut down, because we were asking, you know, we were asking all the right questions, apparently, but the network, True TV, shut us down because he had challenged, I think it was because of the episode that he did about FEMA, FEMA camps, maybe, was that like he triggered something?But there were some things that we touched upon that were like, okay, the show is canceled.

So nowadays, if he'd wanted to, we could have shifted it to like, a TikTok channel or something, we could have continued it.All these conversations that we were having about the Skinwalker Ranch, now there's shows on Netflix about Skinwalker Ranch.The UAP stuff, you know, coming out, the hybrid programs, the reverse engineering being discussed in Congress.So I thinklike the awakening is more important than the events themselves.The events themselves, because like this is a reality where unfortunately, yes, like it's painful, it's full of suffering, there's sorrow, our loved ones are gonna die one way or another, everything's gonna pass in this world, right?

So what matters is where are we awakening to the reality?Are we seeing the spiritual forces that are at work.And if we can, again, choose light instead of darkness, I do believe we can create a better reality.But it starts with awakening and realization, not being, we're gonna put this in the corner, we're not gonna discuss the pedophilia.No, that's being discussed openly now.We're not gonna discuss the rape and murder and cannibalization of kids.

No, we're gonna discuss that.Because by becoming aware of it, now we can get to a place of, okay, all of this somehow exists in our reality.let's choose a better version.Let's choose a better version of reality, where this doesn't happen as prevalently, if at all.

So the awakening is worth the suffering that leads to it?It's the only way.

It's the only way to awaken is to suffer.So Buddha sees suffering in the world.He says, I want to understand what's causing this.Get to the heart.He wants to awaken.He wants to create a more compassionate reality, even though he knows that suffering will still exist.

So it doesn't have to be as evil as cannibalizing, you know, people and murdering women and children and all these horrible things.But there will still be suffering in our reality at this point of human experience, right?We're still going to suffer illness and old age and death until, you know, God decides that we enter a more golden age.

Sean Stone, thank you very much.It's a pleasure.