Russian Spy: Dark Reality of Mind Control, Seduction & Manipulation | Aliia Roza | FO523 Raj Shamani

You were an intelligence agency.Take me through a mission.

We had this criminal gang.When we started our observation, I found out that this young man loved to go to clubs and surround himself with a lot of women.But then what we noticed, some of these women would be disappeared.They would probably be kidnapped for like sales abroad.So the next club night, I was dressed up and I did work.He invited me to the table.

I went to him to his house.So I told him, why don't I do massage for you?And in 40 minutes, he fell asleep.And I opened the door.They came in, arrested some of the parts.

Alia Rosa, a former secret agent and behavioral profiling expert.If you've ever wondered how spies think or how manipulation actually works, this episode is for you.Tell me things from the trainings that you thought was unusual.

How would you do that?Right after the sex they would say this?the brain believing that yes, she's right.I am only successful if she's next to me.

You learned all of these techniques and then you graduated because you got a diploma.Can you show me a diploma?Yes.

And actually this is first time when I show this document.

in a room and let's say there's some target and you want that person to be influenced, what do you first notice?

I can take someone's Instagram and understand exactly what this person is about.When you see a lot of selfiesthis is a sign of a narcissistic person.When men, they post a lot of pictures of them in the gym.It's like, look, I'm alpha male, strong.It is a red flag.

What is something else that would tell you something about women?

You know, in the group pictures, somebody's hiding behind you and like doing this.So this person is hiding something insecure about his or her body.And I also would say this person is shady.

Let's say there's a woman who wants to manipulate or influence a man.What would you do to make man just completely be mad in love with you?Before we start today's podcast, if you have found anything valuable from this channel, please subscribe.It's free.It takes less than a minute, but it means a lot to us.And to listen to the audio experience of this episode, please follow us on Spotify.

This episode is brought to you by our travel partner, Goibibo.Check out the link in the description to download the app and avail exclusive first time user discounts.the training programs usually are very intense.Yes.Was there a moment in training that was designed to break you?

Oh, yes, absolutely.You see, the easiest way to control someone's mind is to make this person to be physically exhausted.I would literally sleep four hours a day.And of course, at some point, you would be just so exhausted that you would agree to whatever just like give me some time to sleep or let me just relax a little bit and physical activities also so you seewhen you are super busy with lessons and homework and physical activity, you don't have time to actually evaluate and digest what's really going on with you and you accept all the information you're given.Actually, I remember now there was like one interesting class which I I don't know if any other agencies have that in other countries, but okay, so we were sitting for like 40 minutes in front of the computer, so each student in front of the computer, and I don't know, that's quite crazy.

So there would be, I don't know even what it was, so there would be a very loud sound, but no words, it's like a sound with a particular rhythm.

Okay.

I would, I suggest there would be like a 25, they call it, sorry.So, oh my God, coding.I think like it's coding.So when you hear a sound, there is a coding behind.

Okay.

And the coding would program your brain, but you wouldn't be able to hear and understand it.So your unconsciousness would accept it.Does it make sense?No?Okay, so the sound was like this.I don't know.

We had to sit in front of this computer for 40 minutes and there would be different graphics, but again, no particular shapes.I would think it's sort of like a hypnosis, but with the coding behind it.

And what would that do to you?

I suppose it was sort of programming, brain programming, like brainwashing.That's what I think, I believe.Because in this, like after, I remember after that you have this feeling like you are very like you feel emptiness and at the same time you feel peace and at the same time you have no fears whatsoever so if you would be if you would be asked like are you scared today tomorrow you would be like i don't care that's kind of like feeling i had after this weird sessions yes tell me was tell me two more two three more things from the trainings that you actually thought was very different or unusual Well, the absolutely the whole sex techniques for me as a virgin were very unusual.I mean, we've been taught like, I mean, you have Kama Sutra, right?

Yeah.

So that actually was part of our training as well, like different sort of positions and all that.

So they would teach you everything about sex and sex techniques?

Yes.But mostly it would go to how to please your partner, where his erosion zones, where his most sensitive zones, how to put anchor on your target's body so this anchor would work.So you can use this anchor for good and for bad.For good, it would be you can like literally make your partner feeling that I'm the best because the most powerful moment you can do it during the ejaculation.at the same time in opposite you can ruin someone's self -esteem if you also at the same time would say like you're the loser and you're the worst person and you are the worst, you know, in sex for example.I'm just saying.

So it's so powerful because when man particular after ejaculation he has the most vulnerable relaxed time where his brain consume and accept any information you say.

To anchor technique, you said.What is that?

There's so many anchor techniques.You can actually anchor yourself for a success, for example.

But in this particular way, what did they teach you?What was the anchoring technique they would teach you related to sex?

To make our target to be dependent in sexual way from you.So and also not to be able to be aroused with any other female partner so he would be only hooked on you.

How would you do that?

Anchoring techniques.

Is there any technique that you can share?

I mean, yes, I don't mind.Maybe if your audience would spot that somebody tries to do it on you, so you must know that this is manipulation, because I totally believe that honey trap is manipulation.And that's why I share to people how not to get trapped.Okay, if your partner tells you particular words, for example, If your partner says after education, oh, you're the best, you are the best.like this, for example, intercourse, like this sex was the best in this case, and also touch the part of the body which should be your sort of like spot, which is not that let's say like public for example it shouldn't be hands because we do like handshakes and all that so it would be for example neck or maybe shoulders or maybe ear you touch that or you kiss it or you you know bite it a little bit slightly and you tell these words and you will repeat it a few times straight after the ejaculation that's a very strong technique to make your man believe that he is the best and his confidence just goes up.But this is also good for wives because in this case, if they want to motivate their husband to go and work harder, this really helps.

I believe in you.You're the best.But in a way, manipulators using it or like honey trap agents, they would say, we, we are the power couple and use the same things.Only i can help you only with me you can have such a pleasure only with me you can be strong only i know how to make you successful i know i am the best in your life so in this case right after the sex they will say this yes and also with the touching the same spotAnd every time when you want to activate this spot, even though you're in public or another day or something, you can also touch it and same the same code name like words.This activates the brain believing and also have a confirmation if somebody would say that, yes, she's right.

I am only successful if she is next to me. I like this example of Napoleon and Josephina.You know what she would tell him?And she was a great manipulator.She told him, you are nothing without me.Repeat it.so he would repeat it and what we say we are what our brain believes and he would say i'm nothing without you so he gives confirmation to his brain that i cannot live without her even though she was cheating on him publicly and everybody knew that the whole country he still was with her till her death interesting you also said that the intelligence would teach you a certain sex techniques, and as a young person, it was very unusual for you to just learn that, but they would work.

What, what sex technique and intelligence agency would teach you that this will get a man completely off guard?

Well, a lot.

Give me one because you said you compared it eye to eye with Kama Sutras.I want to understand what is the intelligence technique that an agency is telling you?

Yes.They'll start from what every person needs and every person has their own fetishes, preferences in particular sex.Everybody likes it.stuff.Everyone's body is unique.And when you find these, let's say, weak spots, and when you fulfill these gaps, the man, if you're talking about men, and also women, most likely would never go to another sex partner because they have the best experience with you.

But how do you identify that?

a lot of conversations, a lot of just, let's say, during the whole intimacy, you can ask questions.Do you like this?Do you like that?If I would do this, would you like that?Or maybe even before or after intercourse, a lot of interaction.And actually, it does help to also couples when wife and husband speak and share what they like what they don't like which is quite normal and it's communication and also trying different things like not just different positions but for example having a wild intercourse in public, let's say in the parking lot, in the car, in the forest or while you do hiking or maybe in the movie theater.

Because this is also unusual and it gives you a lot of adrenaline, which is together with dopamine, it gives you such a big boost.Or for example, you You know why teenagers like horror movie?Because of adrenaline and then after they have like this arousal, the sexual arousal, because of the same thing.It's a component of these hormones.And for example, or you go for, you know, likeattractions, and you do like this roller coaster, right.

And then like, again, you have adrenaline.And if you are with your partner, most likely you'll have like a great sex.So when you combine all these things together, but also what I would suggest giving, in this case, particular man giving him freedom to do whatever.Yeah, like every man's really desire is to have this ability to do what he wants with the female body.I mean, this is nature, but I'm not talking about every man, but or very common thing if a man has a very difficult, hard job, maybe he's CEO or politician.and the whole day he has to command and give orders, most likely he would want to take orders from a female to tell him what he needs to do in order to relax and get like, you know, sort of like dominant females where he can just relax and receive a pleasure.

So there's so many different things, but again, like you just need to Listen to your target number one.

So the strategy would be talk a lot, talk about all these exciting, adventurous stuff, get them to do that once so that they start feeling like, oh, this is the most amazing thing in the world.And then say them certain words and then do it again and again and again, whatever they like.

And that's how you get them addicted.Not only that.Also, there are a lot of emotional stimulation, like, for example, emotional swings.When you give a lot of love bombing, for example, you just met and this is what manipulators do.You meet, he is incredible, she's incredible, you have chemistry, butterflies in your belly, wow, this is the man of, or like the woman, the perfect in my life.And you have this communication, a lot of messages, calls, maybe some presents, love bombing, a lot of attention, a lot of like, you know, connection.

And when you already get used to it, then the person just disappears.And what happened?our brain receives a lot of attention, which is a lot of dopamine, and then at one point, there is no dopamine anymore.So what our brain does, it goes really crazy.And what you do, you only think about this person, you cannot eat, you cannot work, you cannot concentrate on anything else.And you think like, I'm in love with this person, and you try to find this person and you can't.

And then this manipulator would like professional pick up artist would come back and say, Oh, I'm so sorry, I, I went to the hospital, I had a car accident, or I lost my phone or something happened.And it's a strategy.And again, he or she would give you a lot of love bombing and compliments and time and energy.and then again something would happen till the moment you realize that you're so hooked and you're so addicted of these emotional swings and you cannot live without it because like what happensdopamine rush like it goes up then down again like you know it's like sort of like consumption of drugs and when you know like this swings you get used to it to get addicted especially when in your childhood you had narcissistic father and mother who would do the same one day they would be loving parent and give you compliment and like hug you everything and the next day they would call you names or like just ignore you and For you, this is your pattern.So in the future, you would look for somebody like that who would behave like that.

Interesting.So you learned all of these techniques and then you graduated because you got a diploma.Can you show me a diploma?

Yes.So I'll show you a few documents.And actually, this is first time when I show these documents like this publicly.I do send these documents when I when i give interviews to different i don't can we show it in the camera and i can show it to you but like without surnames because yeah yeah i cannot do it it's classified and this is the translation and this is original as you can see i mean this is like what 22 years or something and i'll blur it i'll blur the name then i can show this in the camera please blur it please please please please i'm begging you because this is very i'm not don't worry uh for 20 years i'm uh hiding my identity So, this is translation and I have this.

What's this?

This is apostyle.So, if a document you translate, it has to be original, they give you apostyle.So, it's meaning that it's real.Like the authenticity of the...And this is apostyle for this.for the diploma.

So.

So this is your, for the role of junior police agent for the operational and criminal investigation department of administration of internal affairs.

And just to confirm with my surname and name.So this is my, I don't have it of course, but this is my real name, combining with this, because now you can see that it's the same surname and the same ID, my first driving license, which I got in Russia.So yeah, so this is only my proof.

You look different here.

Of course I do.Of course.You know, I had to change my...You look so different.Yes, of course.I mean, look, in the end of the day, Now, no, but before you wanted to blend with other people if you're really a spy because you don't want to be over.

But again, depends on your mission.If you are spying on someone, you probably should be like the whole crowd.For us, for example, like some of us we had to be like outstanding and more kind of like yeah attractive what are these pictures so this is me taking an oath so you can see like how the academy looked like you see like these floors everything is gray this is after the oath this is the uh this is after the oath this is after what after the oath the oath yes so this is yes this is this is so this is taking the oath uh You can see some of my previous classmates.The thing is that these photos have been done on this office.small film, yes, you know, like, what tape, and then you had to go and like, print it.So it's not it's, it's not digital.

So it's really bad.This is also but like, please do not show her face because I don't know what's her situation.But this is the You see, like how I say about portraits, so there are a lot of portraits, a wall full of portraits.So when you look at all these people, you feel like, wow, this is incredible.This is some of my...This was before.

I did it for another...

What does this mean?

It means two centuries protecting the country for two centuries.

Oh, that's why 1802 to 2002.

Yeah.some of my former classmates and this is my dad but please also don't and this is my grandfather actually who has the his name is is graced on the biggest monument in Stalingrad after the second war.So he was a hero.

He's your grandfather.

This is my grandfather.This is me. I was just born.And this is my father who served in the military, but just like, yeah, I want you.So, but yeah, so I'm coming from the family of military.Yeah.So that was my, only one future, I wouldn't be able to work in fashion.

And only after 30 years, I was able to do what I want.And I was able to go to, you know, Setoto Morangoni and study fashion.And I did work there for 10 years.

Nice.Nice.So take me through a mission from briefing to step by step implementation and to the exit.Like what happened?

To the exit?

Yeah, like from starting till the exit, like give me step -by -step.

Okay.I'll tell you about one mission, but the person is already dead.If it's okay.All right.And it was like in the beginning, beginning.All right.

So after working in the department for maybe like six months about, we had this new criminal gang.which was quite powerful in the city, but again, they were not that big, because again, they were like a lot of big, it's like, I wouldn't call it right now in Russian, because people wouldn't understand anyway, but they were like some big criminal gangs, and then they were like under, it's like an umbrella, under there would be like some small gangs.So that was a small gang, which was supposed to bring us to the big one, which in the end was Vladimir.So, when we started our observation, our mission, I found out that this young, quite handsome man, he loved to go to clubs, like, you know, disco clubs.And he would always get a table and surround himself with a lot of women.beautiful.

But then what we noticed after some time, some of these women would be disappeared.So we kind of like we didn't know we didn't have any evidences yet.But we could suggest that these women, these young girls,I'm talking about like 18 -20 years old, so not like really women, they would probably be kidnapped for eventual like sales abroad.Because again, like Russian, Slovakian looking women are the most expensive women for sex trafficking.Why?

Because of the look.You know, like in model agencies, it was at some point the boom for Russian models.Tall, blue eyes, blonde hair, you know, just beautiful, beautiful girls.So these girls would be kind of like disappeared because we would have reports from parents like, oh, our daughter went to the club and she never came back.and every time this guy would literally have like every evening different girls like five four like maybe more around him and it always would be him and girls and just like some security guys like driver and security and like also criminals but like low level so I actually did like it at some point because I started to go to the club every evening, which was kind of cool because it was my job.So you see, like sometimes when you watch these movies, sometimes it does a little bit of work like that because the club was really, you know, popular.

It was number one.Of course, you couldn't be able to get in unless you know someone.And I remember I was spotting what these girls would wear and then the next day I would go to the market and buy the same tights and I remember particularly they were like particular tights because like I mean it's all about the look right so umyou want to seduce your target or you want him to like you, you should adopt those looks and manners and behavior like he's, you know, ideal, like image.So the next club evening, like club night, I was dressed up.At the same time, one of my colleagues was also there, so he was like at the bar and I, of course, if you want to get attention, you should dance.

I wouldn't say I'm a good dancer as any Indian women because I love Indian dances and I'm not that good, but yet I did my best and he did notice me.So that was our plan.he invited me to the table.I came to the table, I started to talk to him.Of course, I gave him a lot of attention.I was telling him funny stories, giggling and all that.

Because at that point, I needed him to choose me over other girls, because like he had so many girls around him, so I had to be the best.And at some point I, um, sat down closer to him.So in this case, I could speak with him and I was whispering him some stuff to his ears, provoking him.And it did work.So that night, I went to him to his house.Of course, with the escort of other criminal like employees, like security and drivers, but I mean, it's sort of okay.

So I actually, another skill I gotI learned how to do a massage, a really good massage.And you know that there's some points, some spots on your body, some points, especially in Chinese medicine they use acupuncture, but some spots on your body where you can press you can actually make anyone to fall asleep or and relax or you can make anyone to be aroused right so if you know like a way to press it and you know what i'm talking about so i told him oh like because at the same time i needed to get some time more for my team to be able to come to the house and besides we also had some evidences but not a lot in order to arrest the whole team criminal team and I needed to buy some time.So I told him like, oh darling, you know, you look so tired.Why don't I do massage for you?And the massage would take me like good one hour.

And he was like thinking he was planning that we will have intercourse after the massage.So I did specifically as I've been told.And literally, in 40 minutes, he fell asleep, which actually gave me time to slowly and very subtly go and open the door behind so my team could walk in.And I also need to mention that in some parts of the team, they do cleaning job, meaning that they are the ones who are terminating the target.So that was all I needed to do.I opened the door.

They came in, arrested someone.of the parts.

But without security, like security wouldn't be there?

Security wasn't in the same room.We were in the bedroom, which is like a separate.But how did your team get into?From the back door.And the security was from the main gate, which is more like dining area and outside.So that's why they went to the back door.

But we did study the house.Where does he live?What does he do?Where does he go?And who, how many people?He didn't, he wasn't there with so many people, usually like two men.

to criminals, so yes.

That's how the mission was accomplished, okay.Tell me, you also say that you weaponize perfume.What is a special sort of perfume?

I wouldn't say it's a special weaponize, I would say, okay, so here's the thing.You know that people estimate and evaluate us during three, five seconds, even before we start to talk.right and that's why usually men and women too they look at us at the new person they first of all they look at the face then like so till here like this is the main thing and then they look down right so this is like a few things a few seconds they estimate you it does depend from your position your energy how you carry yourself your posture everything but then when they come to you when you approach them the next thing they smell you They don't like particularly smell you, but it's like still animal instincts.So they kind of like sniff you.So, do I like you?Do I not?

Do I want to speak with you or just say anything or not?So KGB scientists created a special formula for the perfume.And it's quite organic because it does include some oil from theRussian territory based plants.I don't know if they grow in the Netherlands but I do know that they grow in Russia for sure.And they just created this formula and I would say it's sort of like seductive scent which you can apply to your body and it does increase your own pheromones which your body creates because we all have our pheromones especially at the moment of our arousal the body creates that so this perfume helped to increase these pheromones and hence it does help you with interaction with other, particularly like male with a man than female.

And what happens, like if you apply that perfume, a man would probably be more attracted to you?

Yes, there would be like...Versus others?Yeah, so men usually would be more attractive or you would just compliment, oh, you look so smart, what is this perfume?Like, you know how many times I got this compliment, like, I like your perfume, what is it?Oh, it's a very, very special, it's just like, well, like women would say like, oh, wow.like where can I buy it?

So the funny thing, so many actually, I don't know, like every time I speak about it, so many people direct message me on Instagram saying like, what is this perfume I want to get?And this is like question number one, which is cool.So I actually gave that.So I have that bottle 20 years ago.So I gave that formula to the factory in US.So now they're trying to uh create similar perfume so I can actually you know give it to people because um it's quite great because you feel first of all you feel more confident second it does help you in

any negotiations not just romantic but also business you know relationship so you come to the I don't know, like to pitch your project and people like, oh, she's so cool.Do you remember the movie Perfumer?

No.

The French one.So there was a movie, the guy actually would kill beautiful young ladies and get like they, from the skin, he gets like these pheromones, which I'm talking about, and then he would create a perfume.So that perfume was so strong that the moment when he actually dropped some, put some drops on the um on the like like piece of fabric or something and just like you know blew it people started to have intercourses publicly everywhere so that's how does it work do you have that i have i brought it specifically for you i've never show it to anyone besides it looks terrible because it's very old and the color is really bad so don't spray it because i don't think it's it's outdated but yes that that's uh that's what we were given before and it's just so old now but you can spray i don't know like if it's uh it's really outdated but uh maybe spray on something else maybe on the uh napkin so it's uh at least who knows what's in there interesting i can pray can you smell it i can smell a little bit i can smell it too but it smells bad like a few few sweet notes which is good but then it smells like it's an old perfume i'm telling you it looks it smells very very old but it's oily right it like gives you this like oily kind of thing like it's weird like it's a good i could send that it's a it can be a

perfume, but it's like it feels like rotten.

Yeah, I mean, yeah.

There's some sweetness to it.Interesting.

Yeah.

So this you would apply to trying to recreate this.

I mean, you use every everything, every tool you can use in order to succeed in your mission, right?If you really want to be successful, you want to learn as much as you can and practice it and just make it happen.

Yeah.Let's begin from here.Let's say you don't know anything about me.You've just seen me online, probably watched a couple of podcasts.You walked in.I am the target.

I'm a stranger to you.Okay.And then you have like one hour.How will you strategize to figure out that you want to manipulate me or you want to seduce me?Like what are the things that you would identify from my personality if you're meeting me for the first time?In fact, let's do one thing.

Don't give me an answer right now.Okay?Don't give me an answer right now.We'll wait till the end of the podcast.And in the end, you tell me what have you noticed.Okay, so which will help you probably.

Okay, so in this one hour, these are things that I noticed you that I could press you not press you and maybe you could do like, okay, like analysis.

Okay, let's do that.

Yeah, that'll be that'll be good.

That's funny.Yes.That's like a game.I love it.

Okay, so you because you were an intelligence agency, and those intelligence agencies have have spent decades mastering this technique of getting information from other people, right.And cracking them open and you've learned that and now you teach that to people.What is one single thing about human nature that I need to learn?

I would say the most important is patience.

What do you mean by that?

I'll explain.So there are two important big differences.Manipulators, they rush you.For example, when you see this advertisement like, this is the last sales, get it in 10 minutes, otherwise you lose it.or like, you know, like Black Friday is how they push people to buy.And this is manipulation.

Manipulators always rush you, like you have to make this decision now, otherwise you'll lose it, otherwise you'll lose like or your life will be the worst.And people tend to believe and overspend money or getting into a relationship where they don't want businesses, also in business there is a manipulation like that, sign this contract right now or you will be bankrupt or like get this loan right now or like that's it or If you are not sure about the right partner or investor, they would still push you and this is manipulation where they would give you a lot of benefits and they would push you, like they would constantly call you, meet you and just like, come on, come on, let's do it.Like I'm leaving, I don't have time or something else is happening.This is proper manipulation.Secret agents never push.like if they really need to establish trust with the target, never.

They become like this real sort of friend who's always there to support if they need to have with the target a long -term relationship, okay?When it's a short relationship, of course, it doesn't matter how you approach and how you manipulate.You have a compromise, which is compromising material, and they literally tell you, either you work with us, eitherlike, you'll fail.So this is manipulation.But when agent need to establish a trust with an informer, for example, in another country, the agent would give enough time for this target to relax and get used to you.

According to our psychology, we need to see a person or and add seven times at least in order to make a decision to go and buy or to establish like a conversation with this new person.And especially now people, you know, like living in digital world, we lost this kind of communication skills.So if you want to establish a really trusting relationships, give your partner time.do not push, do not call all the time, do not text all the time, don't over spam his emails or whatever, or you need this person for businesses, be there.Maybe the same events, maybe you find out if he goes to a particular gym, get the membership there.Golf, get the membership there.

Conferences, go there as well, but don't approach yet.be somewhere there the peripheral vision and this is social engineering the peripheral vision will see you somber day in the crowd so but then after seven times oh like i can trust this person i can trust this face because i've seen this face already so you give your future partner wherever business romantic enough time to get used to you tell me can i can i manipulate you

by creating an urgency?

Oh, yes, absolutely.

How can I do that?

Romantic or business relationship?

Let's go romantic first, and then we do business.

So, for example, you are dating with a woman, you like her, you invite her to, like, you know, dates.And, for example, I mean, like, this is really dark psychology, and I hope like, man, you're responsible not to.for like, you know, not to do it.It's, it's kind of like a pickup art, I would say, but, um, you know, it's important to know.

So that's how people know what to avoid.

Yeah.Yeah.Yes.Uh, okay.So if you see that someone tells you let's meet today or like tomorrow and, uh, or like come over, let's hang out, especially like this term, or let's do something together today, tomorrow, like now.and you're like, oh, I cannot, today I'm working, no, I cannot, like, you know, he or she would say, no, we need to do it now, because I'm leaving in like, for, let's say, I'm leaving tomorrow for like a month.

So this is creating urgency.Or for example, now I have so many admirers, and you're one of those admirers.So if you don't do it now, you lose your opportunity.So you have to do it now.Not like particularly you're telling, I have a lot of admirers, you show that you have For example, in Instagram stories, you put like, oh, somebody present me flowers, or like somebody present me this, or this guy texted me this or that, for example.And this guy, you would say like, oh, I didn't know, like this, that, like I have so many like other options.

So this is verya kind of like you know urgency or another thing to moving together or making to propose you men be careful if women do this when they so you date not for a long time and then she comes to you and she tells you you know my father is against our relationship, so he will cut me completely if I will not break up with you.So the guy has this option, either I, you know, commit to her and take care about her, either she goes back to daddy and stay with her family.Number one option.Number two, she can say, oh, my ex -boyfriend just reached me out and we broke up because he didn't want to marry me, so now he came back and I said that I'm dating you, but he wants kids and he wants to have a family, so you have to choose now.isn't that red flag you break up with these kind of people yes but the thing is that's what you know we are talking about right now so man would spot this red flags a lot of men they are very naive the naive naive man would fall for this a lot of men would fall for this i will explain why because number one when a woman creates that not everyone but when a woman creates this drama and it's also this dopamine hormone all the time she's so cool she like we have the best sex she uses all the programming anchoring techniques most likely he would be like okay let's just move on like together let's just marry or whatever because he doesn't want to

start the whole dating process again, because it's time consuming and he has job, he needs to be, you know, committed to his job.And now he needs to start again relationship and then invest his time and money and everything.It's easier to be already with her.That's it.That's how men actually think.

It's crazy.

Yeah, but it is what it is.

So true.I can think of some men who I know who think like that.

See, because they think like, I cannot waste my time to do again, like dating apps or like going out and again, like where I would find someone I I'm okay with whom I have, even though she wants to move on or get married, like, eventually...

And a lot of people are like, if I lose her, probably I won't be able to find another one.

Yeah.

Someone as good as her or as...

And especially if she always every day tells you, I'm the best woman in your life, you will never find anyone better.This is a...

Men start believing that.

No, of course, if you every day tell yourself, like, that you are this, you will, you're like Apple, you'll believe you're Apple eventually.

Tell me what, you know, when we talk about all of this, right, there's an important part which is called seduction.People seduce other people in a way that they're not able to move on.And most people think that seduction is just about attractiveness, is it?

No, seduction is not about attractiveness at all.Seduction is about psychological intelligent techniques, and it's about it's an art, and if you craft it, you know how to do it.Seduction is to create the world where your target feels at the best state, meaning when we fall in love, we don't fall in love into a person, we fall in love into this world, into this bubble this person creates for us, whichfeel the best we feel the smartest we feel the most successful isn't it nice when somebody tells you i believe in you you are the best you will succeed no matter what i'm here to support you like you're a genius you like this and this and that of course slowly you start to believe in that begin programming and you fall in love into this beautiful illusory world and you want to stay there because without this person you don't feel so meaningful and valuable that's the art of seduction tell me give me techniques how can you do that to somebody how can you create this world of illusion where other person just seduced by because i hear you seduction is not attractiveness seduction is attention if you pay attention to somebody and create a world where they're feeling the most understood they're feeling seen, they're feeling best of the world, they're feeling that they're the most interesting person in the room.

And if they feel important, they're going to be completely into you, right?

Absolutely.

So what are the techniques?

Number one technique.is active listening.So people unfortunately forget about that.You know, there is even in the history there was like a minister in England, prime minister in England and there were like situation where the queen said, with him I felt that he's the most smartest person in the world, but with another one I felt that I'm the most smartest in the world.So Performing active listening, it's not just sit down and look into the eyes and listen, but it's also askingright questions to lead this conversation like you do right now.

So that's the active listening.Number two, supportive also questions.So for example, when I share my story and you find so many different similarities so you create this emotional bond and my brain eventually will trust you because I say for example oh like I love Indian tea you know, like this is one thing, or I love like Indian culture and congratulations, female cricket team won the World Cup, which is, I think like it was the first time in 47 years, which is incredible, meaning that so many, it's such a huge possibility for women, you know, to grow bigger.And it's amazing.It's like women empowerment.So it's the time is changing.

So when you create a lot of similarities and like this kind of you build the bridge, for example, you have similar interests, you have similar hobbies, and it does create that sort of like connection.The next would be the next step that would be creating something together.and that could be for and good advice also for couples when you want to create family you should start from creating something together a project it could be anything it could be helping every week and volunteer volunteering forcharity and providing food for homeless.It could be having a project to create a new business company, having a project to create and build a house, for example.So, when you find something which you and this person wants to have so you are there to support and help and create this together then again like you unite together for this project so it becomes part of your life and it's so meaningful rather than just have a relationship that just hang out when I'm free because in reality We're never really free.

We're always busy.And great relationships are when you do things together, not just hobbies, not just going out, but also building things together, like businesses, for example.This is, I think, like the power couples are when they build businesses together.Or like when, for example, she is supporting her partner as a let's say PR, like brand manager, or like maybe on philanthropic side, and he is the CEO of the company, or like politician, or like, so he's executive.So, you know, she's helping him, he's helping her.So it's like unity, like yin and yang.

So that's the most powerful relationship, I would say.Seduction also, another step of seduction is, and you see like again, like it's not about really sex.Of course, sex is very important and of course, there's so many techniques as I think likeIndian nation is the first nation in the ancient culture who actually know that and you have Kama Sutra and so on, so you know better than anyone else.But again, without the trust, sex is really nothing.That's why in seduction, the most important is to build this trust and to give your partner, let's say like your target, this trust where it's almost like a soul connection.

And that's why everything in sex is also like, even though in the beginning, nobody has a great sex, but in the beginning, you can always like, you know, share what you like, what you don't like, and slowly you get used to each other's bodies and develop the best techniques which are great for you.

Interesting.Is seduction and manipulation same or different?

Oh, absolutely different.

Give me a difference.

That's a great question.Let me think about it.This is actually a great question.I would say this manipulation is always negative.Manipulation It's always negative for the victim because manipulator wants to take something from the victim and that's why he manipulates the victim.So, it's always negative because it's against the victim's will.

If you're talking about seduction, seduction really can be used and for good and for bad, but when somebody trying to seduce you, it could be just simply because they genuinely like you and they want to be with you, correct?If you're not talking about honey trap, if you're talking aboutlike in a normal day -to -day relationships.Seduction is also the tool to empower someone.Don't you feel nice that women around you flirt with you, trying to seduce you?You feel like, oh, I'm a handsome guy, you know, like it all like the same thing for a girl.

Doesn't happen with me, so I don't know.I mean, like, OK, I guess I'm just kidding.

Yeah.But like, I mean, generally speaking, like when people give you compliments, it does lift up and boost your self -confidence.Right.So seduction in this case can be also can work for you as a self -empowering, self -confident tool.seducing someone is also like a game.There is no need to go to bed straight away, but it could be a nice slight game which can last for a long time and at the same time you feel interested, like it's a playful thing.

So, seduction is not that negative as manipulation because seduction not necessarily has this result of conquering and getting someone.

Okay.

If it doesn't make sense.

So manipulation can be negative.

Manipulation is always negative, yes.Influence.

Yeah, go ahead.

Yeah, but influence is positive because influence, you're influencing people, right, on doing something for collective betterment.

Manipulation is only one person's betterment and another's negative.

Is every human being manipulable?At some point, yes.Even our pets.you know, pets, they do this all the time.Like you have a dog and like, if you don't give a dog the treat, she will pee or poo on your like cupboard.Same with cats, same with kids.

If you don't give the treat or something, they want the toy right now, they will scream.This is also sort of manipulation.Yes.

So is there anyone or genuinely someone who can't be manipulated?

Cannot be manipulated.Yes, it's the person who completely know how to control his emotions and the person who is aware.So that's why here and everywhere in my old platforms I teach people how to support manipulation and in the book which is coming out soon it's all about how not to be trapped because in any relationship, business, romantic, friendship, even the family, the family members, they manipulate us.Oh, I'm so old, you're not calling me like, you know, parents.And if you're not like coming see me, I can die tomorrow.And you will always blame yourself that you didn't see me. I mean, like how many stories we heard like that?

So many, right?It's also part of manipulation.So the thing is, when you are aware of these things, when you know how does it work, because manipulation is everywhere, even in social media or like TV news or everywhere, when you understand how does it work, you kind of like what you need to do, you need to get yourself out from there.It's like a circus, or like a theater, let's imagine.Everywhere, in every relationship, when it's manipulation in particular, there are different actors, and they drag you into their drama, especially some of ourfriends and business partners.

They want you to participate in this drama because they want you to be distracted.Or like the government, what they do.There was a big splash about Epstein files.Now everybody's shifting to the war situation because it's again also destruction.So when you shift yourself from this theater and you become not the one of the actor but you sit there as an audience and you look what's going on and you analyze who's doing what and also give yourself time, that's again like the patience, very important, you would simply understand what's going on and that's why so for everyone I think like the first thing they need to do is always give yourself time.When somebody send me, you know, for any project a contract, and they push me, like sign it now, this is a red flag.

I say I need to send to my lawyer, you know, he will review it and all that.It will take some time.Sometimes it takes like weeks, but give yourself time.When you don't know how to make the right decision, give yourself time, gather information, speak with different friends, colleagues.even like with somebody who understand what to do in this field, but gather information, do the research, learn about each other, like, you know, like just to understand as more, you know, is better.And then you make a decision.

Interesting.When you walk in a room and you know, there are people.Which you don't know.Which you don't know.

Yeah.

And let's say there's some target and you want that person to come to you.influenced or maybe fall in love with you, maybe just start a conversation or something.What do you first notice in first few seconds, the moment you walk in the room and what is specifically that you would notice about that person or about the room, which a normal person like me would not notice?

Well, first of all, before meeting my target, I would always gather as much information as I can.And now in this digital world, it's so much easier.You have social media and I can, you know, take someone's Instagram, go through the field and understand exactly what this person is about.

What were the three things you would look at Instagram and try to gather?

and then you'll make out this is the personality of a person great question thank you i think like everybody like oh my god because i read that uh apparently in this top one uh users of instagram over 500 million people this is incredible 70 a man um because this is this is no this is this is cool i mean like amazing so When you scroll someone's account and you see a lot of selfies, I'm not saying selfies are bad, but this is a sign of a narcissistic person.

Okay.

Why?I will explain.If you see, like, in the field, like, every other row, it's a selfie, this is the signal, this is the sign of narcissism.Why?Because when you always do selfies like that, right it means that you want validation from other people to tell me how beautiful or whatever you are so you're in a circle or yourself opinionis not enough.

So you want this validation from other people.Does that make sense?

Yeah.

For example, this is one thing.

That would mean like I can post normal pictures as well and still look for validation, right?

No, not okay.Like self is like that.

Yeah.

Unless it's a skincare or makeup promo.It's different.This is like a job, it's already content.So yes, when you post pictures about your, let's say, daily life.I actually like your Instagram, so I checked it out obviously before.So some of the carousel you had, like just different collective pictures from what you've done during like a week or a month.

Like you work, you gave a public speaking, you ate this kind of food, you hang out with friends, you like met somebody, you travel and all this.This is great and I think this is really a sign of I'm sharing with you, audience, about my life.This is like a sneak peek about what I do.and I'm sharing this with you, right?So this is great.When men, they post a lot of pictures of them in the gym, you know what does it mean?

Yeah, what does it mean?

It's like, look, I'm alpha male, look, I'm doing gym, meaning that I am, you know, strong, because I'm working out in the gym, it's also like sort of like discipline and commitment.So they want to show that Look, I'm so disciplined.I work out.Look at my muscles.Look, I'm alpha male.Women, look at my muscles.

which is quite silly though but unless you're not fitness coach okay but wouldn't it mean people who post a lot of pictures in gym they're just trying to show off something that they've built after working a lot like after working hard yes like and there's nothing bad in it because they're proud of something they've done yeah but not every picture right this is number one sometimes it ends up becoming the personality because probably five other things which they have done in their life is not as significant or as big as just turning or transforming their body so they're proud about the fact that they're pushing yeah but okay if it's like every other post it's about him with the selfie or like in the mural if it's like this kind of videos like look i was like fat and now i am fit and this is my program i'm sharing with you okay but like not every day of a different muscle and they're just showing up yeah you know like what what does that tell a woman for a woman uh so man apparently they think that this is seducing women only maybe some silly women i don't know but like it's not as a woman you yourself and you have 5 000 people community what do women think about men who post pictures of gym yeah like gym all the time selfies like that it's a red flag wow yeah it is a red flag for sure or men who's always like out like i'm here with buddies in the restaurant i'm here at the red carpet i'm here like you know doing something like this is also like uh very selfish this is like very egocentric way okay because look there's also a red flag this is sort of i mean like it's kind of like show off that a lot of women would be into it right no because they could see a fantasy or a new world that this man can provide which probably they are not

is not.

So these women are gold diggers then.

Okay.

Or like women who want to have this lifestyle because this guy has this lifestyle and they think that if I will be with him, I will have the same lifestyle.That's the...

Like a stable, strong woman would like that.

A stable woman who wants to have a healthy relationship with men would want probably a man who doesn't have Instagram posting every day because If you're not an influencer, and we both know that because we work in that field, if you're not an influencer and you don't make your profit from social media posting, how the heck you have so much time to post pictures every day?Because one post, I don't know how for anyone, but to do one good video, real or whatever post, it takes me minimum one hour.So it's one hour of my life.Even I have a team.but yet it's one hour of my plus.You need to do video, you need to put makeup and hair and all this.

I mean, imagine how...So it means that if he posts and he's not an influencer blogger, so it means that he doesn't have a job, meaning either he's broke or he's narcissistic, he wants validation.So he doesn't have anything in his life apart from just posting.So it's a completely different thing.

So you see that as a red flag.Interesting.Okay, what else you can make it out?You said if you post selfies, then it's a sign of narcissism.If you post a gym pictures.

All the time.

All the time.

Like not gym, like body.Body pictures.Yes.

All the time.What does it say again?

That you need validation.Okay.That look, I'm devoted.

So you're insecure.

That's why you post it.Okay.

And what's the third sign?

For the social media?You know, when people don't have their own opinion, they always reshare someone's content.Like they don't have their own opinion.They see something.news or whatever, and they share it.And the whole field is someone's...

So what does it tell you about a person when they share?

This person doesn't have his own opinion.He's very easily manipulated.He has a victim mentality.

Interesting.And what would it be for a girl?The same thing?

Same thing for everyone.

What would a girl post and what would it signal to you?

a lot of revealing pictures like bikinis like underwear a lot of like skin that's actually is sort of like only fun situation because obviously whom she will attract she will attract a lot of men but so i mean so what what does it tell you about the women who post just these pictures How would a woman see that woman?If a man posts pictures of him with a...

No, if a woman is posting bikini pictures and revealing clothes every day, what do you see it as?

Well, she's obviously selling her body, probably she gets this traffic to lead into the OnlyFans, where she can charge men.

Not everybody would be doing OnlyFans.

I mean, like, as much as I know, every other third girl, seriously.

But I don't believe that every woman who's posting these kind of pictures online would want to do that.They're just doing it maybe just for fun.

Oh, they're looking for sugar daddy.

So you would only see it as a red flag.You wouldn't see it as somebody just revealing...For what?I don't know.I'm asking you from a woman's perspective.

Okay, great thing.So, every action of any person, you should ask the first question, why?Why this person do this?Every...She wants to, who cares?Yeah, but she wants it for what?

For validation, for show, like her body, for what?To attract...

Maybe she's also worked hard for a body and she wants to show that off.

Yeah, but she can show that when she could wear a sport wear rather than bikini, right?

So you would say it's just for, so for men and women both, you feel people who post a lot of shirtless pictures or like bikinis or small clothes, whether men or women, they both are either insecure and wanting a lot of validation or wanting to sell their body or are looking for some sort of or trying to attract the wrong kind of crowd?

Well, it depends.We are like in the market, right?If there is like only funds so popular, so it must be a market.So many requests from men who want that.So they do it for a specific reason.I have a beautiful young body.

Why not to sell it?

Okay, so that's one.What is something else that would tell you something about women from just their Instagram profile?Forget revealing clothes.Something else that they show a lot.

You know, in the group pictures, like, you come, you like, you know, with the company and you have a dinner, for example, everybody like, oh, let's do a picture.So when you see that somebody hiding behind someone, like, for example, it's you standing and somebody hiding behind you and like doing this.This is also speaking about, so this person is hiding something insecure about his or her body.And I also would say, not like about, like, I wouldn't trust, but this person is shady.So when you see like these pictures like that, and you see like everybody stands straight, and there is another person who's like...

So you wouldn't trust this person just because they're trying to be goofy?

It's not a goofiness.It's like they do it all the time.And it's not like for fun.They actuallylike that, this is their personality.You see, the thing is, okay, in order to really read a person, you need to analyze the body language and facial expressions, because you can tell whatever you want, but you will never ever be able to fake your energy and your memories.

when you ask about memories, you cannot fake this.You know, when I speak about my childhood drinking Indian tea, I cannot fake it because this is my pure real emotions when I remember that moment.And if you want to spot the lie, if somebody tells you words which you want to hear, ask about past memories, about emotions or like how do you feel yourself no but like really how do you feel yourself and like go deep into emotional level because that somebody nobody can fake so what would a person's body language will tell you that words never can that that uh they lie no about anything what would a body language reveal because you said analyze the body language yeah what would it reveal that words will not be able to there's so many actually you can also control your body language you know that yeah you can simply control and your facial expression and body language and people say like oh you like have this kind of like hands it's sort of like you have a closing position in fact it's not necessarily i just may have like uncomfortable jacket and i just want to cover it or maybe i don't feel like good i just want to kind ofof to hug myself or like it could be so many different things or when people say that um if you look left corner on the top that that means that you're lying absolutely not because sometimes you uh you can remember something yes so the body language I think will never lie when you have a conversation and you talk about emotions, right, about memories, but also you need to see, now at the moment we're sitting, you know, we're sitting, we're not standing, and we have a table which is an object, which I cannot say the whole body language, but if you don't have the table and we sit in front of each other, you would see how would I change my legs, for example, do I cross it, do I know, sometimes, you know, people trembling their feet what does it mean it means like nervousness anxiety which feels like i don't like this question i feel like like i want it to be and as soon as possible well for example you have a conversation and then if i would like sit for example looking at that corner like like this.So I'm shifting my whole body in a sort of like, I don't want to engage with you, engage with you.So I'm kind of like closing myself.

Or for example, when if I would have like, a ban or like cop, for example, and I would trample my fingers or like use any object all the time.This also means that I am either nervous, I have anxiety, I hide myself or like I hide my thoughts or something like that.So really like observe thebody and also the all human beings feel connected.Observe the energy.Yeah, like you feel my energy totally, right.

But I do bad that you had some guests where you felt that they had, like energy, like, which was closed, and you couldn't, you know, open that sort of gate.And you were trying too hard to them to be open, right.So, feel it, like trust your gut, inhale, exhale, and just feel your energy aligned with your energy and like it's, you know, we're all connected.That's how you feel it.

Okay.Is there a technique that you make that you make target come to you and you don't go there?

Yes, in fact.

How do you make people come to you rather than you go to them?

Professional secret agent would never, a female particular, would never approach male target herself, simply because in man nature, he is the conqueror.And if he sort of decides that I want to approach this woman and this is my decision so hence of course she cannot be a spy and she cannot be manipulated because it was my decision.But in fact she would already initiate the whole social engineering and the whole trap for him even before he would even think about it.For example, Social engineering, I will not get into how we did it with Vladimir because it's long and I've told that so many times, but for example,let's say you have a target and you know what kind of colors, what's his favorite color, what's his favorite place, where does he go and everything.And that's also how we did it.

You can actually create that setting where you would, for example, as a woman, come with like two, three girlfriends, but they're less beautifully looking as you are, for example, then you initiate eye contact.And this is like simple contact, like always like do like two seconds straight, then like down, then again, then you know, like how it is, like how women play with eyes, it's, everybody knows, but this is a signal for men.Then again, if a woman sits in front of him and slightly, for example, like, you know, just, like, touch her neck, hair, this is also a signal.Lips, neck, you know, shoulders, like this, it's also signals.If she drops something in front of him, like, and, like, picking it up, this is also a signal.There's so many signals.

Or she walks to the restroom and she walks near to him so he could see her this is also signal or if she would come closer if it's a bar for example and um she would ask the barman but loud enough so he could hear for example what does this gentleman drinks drinks looks looks so nice i want the same what does he drink so it's already kind of like ah she wants the sameAnd then she's like, oh, would you like to try?Or like, it's really nice.And she's like, oh, what is it?So that's it.You started the conversation.

There was one actually great example that a nuclear scientist was targeted by a high -need drug agent.And she was standing just nearby on the street.and when he and she knew that he was smoking when she started to when he started to smoke she just took the cigarette from her back you know wanted to smoke and you know and he and he literally said in interview you know i was smoking i looked into her eyes she looked into my eyes i was like let me give her like you know later later and That's it.And then eventually she was a spy.But the thing is, it was his and he couldn't believe that she was a spy because it was his decision.So there's so many techniques how you can do it, but you actually never approach your target yourself.

How do you make somebody trust you?

I would say like, it's not just like building the trust.It's like how to make someone to like you.Of course, number one, the whole behavioral aspect, mirroring the intonation of the voice, eye contact, active listening, creating mutual interest, bridges about your past, even though you may have completely different backgrounds, but you need to find something where you can align together and connect.like, oh, I also like cricket.I also like this movie.But this is not trust yet.

This is like clickability.So it's slowly, slowly, slowly moving into more trust because trust you cannot gain in just one meeting.It takes time.So another one would be, for example, it's good to say what you're going to do and actually do it and do it a few times so the person actually feels like, oh, I can trust him because, you know, like scammers they do, they come to you, they say like, hey, Rush, can you invest like $5 ,000 to like new startup and you'll get 10 ,000 in one month?Like this guy got his money, this guy got his money, we all invested and we got like, you're like, okay, 5 ,000, it's okay, even if I lose it, like, okay, let me try.You invest.

In one month, they give you 10 ,000.Hey, Rush, great job.How about like investing 10 ,000 to, you know, like more like whatever stocks or whatever the products of this company.In one month, you'll get 20.So you do it again and again, you got the, like, you're 20.And then again, again, and again, until the moment where you invest big amount and then they disappear.

So this is how they, these scammers, manipulators and everybody, they build this pyramid.They let you like slowly to, you know, get the trust, build the trust.And then eventually when you completely like hundred percent, you trust this person, they're gone.

There's one more, one more trick that a lot of manipulators use, right?It's called manufactured vulnerability.It's like you show somebody weakness, but just a little bit so that the man feels like he has to now protect you.Like you don't show a lot of weakness, but you don't show a lot of power.You just show a little bit of vulnerability and a little bit of weakness.So that man starts feeling like now I have to protect her, I have to be the savior because this little thing, this little weakness, like she can't tell it to the world or nobody can hurt her on that.

This is for women only, right?

Yeah.

Because like men usually they don't want to show vulnerability.

Yeah, men like to protect, right?So women can show certain level of manufactured vulnerability so that man feels like now I need to protect her.

Yeah, and like a lot of women actually use it against men.That's why also like men have to be careful with that.Because, I mean, yes, women do that.They... pretend sometimes to be weak and vulnerable so men take the whole, you know, responsibility and take care about them and that's...I would say this.This is so... ancient that like it's just like women are like women nature is like that and even in animal world they do this so i don't know if it's a manipulation i don't think so i think it's sort of it's innate nature this is this is natural you know you in middle of conversation somewhere you spoke about because we're talking about women specifically you spoke about post -collateral window right Post what?

Post colital window.You know that window right after the sex, there's like 15 -20 minutes when a man is completely wild.

Oh yes.yes, yes, yes, yes.

So you usually call it post -coital window.

Oh, yeah.Okay.I didn't know that.Okay.

Yeah.So it's like, so I think, yeah, it's post -coital window or post -coital window.I don't know how to pronounce it properly.But this is what it means.It means that because you're dopamine is so high and then you just release it after that.After sex, there's like 15 -20 minutes where usually men will believe whatever you'll tell them.

And they're so vulnerable that they'll give you all the information that you want to extract out of them as well, right?

Yes.

What as an agent, what would you do in those 15 minutes where you know, like, this is my best window?

Everything from questions how many people work with you for example like oh you you look so tired like what nobody is helping you there why do you do all the job yourself like do you have anyone to help you like how many colleagues do you have and who's your boss is he okay oh he's such a bad blah blah blah boss What's his like and he would like when somebody speaks about like of course at some point they would give you names and the whole information and you would ask like oh do you think like how long does he work here what exactly does he speak with this one and this one does he know about this one does he communicate with that one what do you think so like you know you lead the conversation you ask all these questions because obviously you look so tired like you know let's speak about your job and you'll feel much better about of course it wouldn't wouldn't be direct questions questions like what classified information do you know about nuclear weapon how can people use this in real life let's say if there's

there's a woman who wants to manipulate or influence a man. I would say influence men.What would you say?What would you do in that in those 15 minutes to make man just completely be mad in love with you?Because those 15 minutes will be the best time to feed in the programming.

Starting from I because then you connect yourself like you're saying like from I I believe you have never had any experience like that.I believe that I am the most, and wherever, elegant, beautiful, best woman in your life.I know, because this is already a statement, it's not a question, I know that you really like me, or like further, I know you love me, even though he didn't say I love you.So it's all about like you know it's a statement but what if a man is just like man thinks like man knows that this is not the best woman i've been with then would you still would he still would he say that no but like would he start believing when a woman says even though if he knows that you you would know that and we discussed that if you like say somebody every single time these things you start to believe in that slowly and then you're like oh maybe that girl was better but why did we break up oh yeah right she was hysterical well at least this is not yeah i guess like we have the best relationship yeah i guess she's right something will hit and something will make me believe that yes because this is statement this is not women do mistake when they say do you meanme do you love me this is the worst question they can ever ask man please don't do it why are women because it's a question what do you answer do you love me you answer either yes either no will you marry me either yes or no if you want to influence someone you don't ask these questions or the question should be are we getting married this year or next year so you don't have you don't give other option you only give two things all i can do this is this is what we should do or not do this is what you should you should do if you want him for example to get married to propose you um like so explain me so you said do you miss me is a bad way of putting it yeah every question did you miss me this morning or right now is that a better question yes instead you say i know you miss me that's it i know you miss me i know you love me that's it it's a statement no no you don't do you because it's a question where you get you give the right to the person to think and say either yes or no so if you don't want person to think think and it's it is sort of influence and you want him to go to direction you want him to go, you say statements like, I know you miss me. I know I'm the best.I know we have the best relationship, whatever.

And the second thing you can do, you want tea or coffee?There is no question, do you want tea or do you want coffee?Do you want tea or coffee?Do you want to marry today?or I mean like this year or next year?So it's you don't give any other option and see it's positive.

So he will answer you what you want to get eventually.

Interesting.What are the other two mistakes?Because this is a great thing.You said women make this one mistake where they ask question where a man has to think.So you give them options.

In relationship.

Give statements or give two options, just like don't keep it open.So that's one.One.Give it two more mistakes.

Two, give a man his freedom.Meaning, please don't call or text every time asking, what are you doing?Where are you?With whom are you?This is like, no, this is red flags.Everybody will get annoyed after some time because You know what I'm saying.

We want to have our freedom, we want to have our privacy.If I want to share with you what I was doing today, I will tell you.Number three, and this is also a bad kind of like thing to do, to bring a third person into your relationship.It could be your family members, it could be friends, anyone.If you bring a third opinion into your bond, eventually it will destroy your bond.Because like, oh, she said, he said that you didn't do it right, or you should have done this, or you didn't do this.

And like, oh, my mom said that you should treat me better, or my dad said, or like my girlfriend.the third opinion eventually will win you can say like oh my friendslike my parents really like you and they're very happy for me and for us.that's it that's it but when you start to go to the third person and say oh you know what he did he did this and this and this and then you would pass this information what the third the third person said to your partner and then it will create the whole drama so either you go to the therapist and you complain and get it out of your system or write it down and get it out from your system but don't bring the third person especially if it's a close friend or a relative interesting tell me you you like when i search about you online and when i like do a research on you the one word which highlights it sexpionage what does sexpionage mean it means a lot but usually when people um hear sexpionage they always think about sex in fact sexpionage honey trap honey pod It's all about psychological intelligence, when you know psychological techniques, how to influence people, how to persuade people, how to subtly program their mind, and hence how to seduce them in order to establish long -term relationships and get information.Because it would be simple to say, oh, you just need to kill this person.But the thing is, you know, that body, no information, no need.

So how to make someone to really trust you and share with you some classified information, right?you need to establish this trust and that's what is sex espionage and I would say intimacy probably would be 10 % from the whole sex espionage.strategy.

Okay.

90 % it's all about social engineering.It's about emotional bond, building trust.

Interesting.You know, when I hear about sexpionage or the world, it looks like it's some James Bond fantasy movie.And then all you do is use psychologically get someone you build a relationship with someone get them into honey trap and then extract information and i'm i'm sure majority of the people who are watching this they would have the same same kind of image tell me one brutal truth about your world which will shatter this image of james bond fantasy in our heads oh my god i have so many stories and let's start from the history of It's like a spionage honey trap.

So, before the Second War, in 1930s, Stalin, actually, had received an information that his main general, I think his name was Tunchinsky, he was seduced by the German spy.female spy.

Okay.

And she extracted a lot of information.So Stalin that time decided to create a special program, which is sexpionage.So in 1931, they started to build schools with this program.The program would last from six months to eight months, sometimes to two years, it depends.But the initial program six months, that's exactly the program which I attended.And of course,

it's really classified information.If you would ask Russian, they would say, yes, we heard about it, but we don't know for sure if it does exist and where these schools are.And in fact, this is so classified information than when I just got enrolled, and I will tell you a little bit later story how did it happen with me.For example, my military, Academy, and I actually called them two years ago, it burned down with all the archives.That's why I said to you, thank God I was able to get some archive documents to prove it.And the thing is, that's what's happening.

Every single military academy, they choose a few students which they think could be potential asset.they choose those students and they educate them with these particular subjects, with these lessons, and then they give them missions to, you know, whatever, execute or honey trap or like spy on someone, depends.In terms of examples, there's so many examples in the world, in the history.

Okay, give me one.

Actually, when I was doing my research in 1950, Indian handsome young diplomat attended Soviet Union and he was honey -trapped by the ballet dancer.

Okay.

So how does it usually, how it used to work in Soviet Union?I'm not sure it does work right now in Russia, but it was exactly 100 % how it was in Soviet Union.Foreign diplomat comes or like ambassador comes to Soviet Union and there would bethese beautiful actresses, models, singers, you know, like celebrity females who already collaborated with NKVD, KGB, like hence, like it was NKVD, then KGB.So, and everything based on the patriotism.So because you're a real patriot, you have to help government.

So the KGB, sorry, the KGB team would establish the whole social engineering.So they would spy on the target.What's his preferences?What does he like?What's his inner circle?Where does he go?

How many, like, you know, coffee does he drink a day?Everything.Then they would hand all this information to the female agent, the they would call them swallow.So this swallow female agent would be taught how to make this allure, how to approach him or how to make him approach her.And for example, this young Indian woman, for example, when he had an affair, in a hotel room usually the KGB would have this glass like mirror but behind they would be recording cameras and then after the you know sexy night they would come to the diplomat and give all these papers all these photos all these like videos and would say now either you work with us and tell us all information we want to know about your country either we will pass this information to your government, that you have an affair with the Russian KGB agent, or to your family members, your wife, and sometimes diplomats, theywho were trapped, highly trapped, they would either go and work with the KGB or simply like Indian diplomat, by the way, bravo to him.

He said he actually laughed and he said, like, so what?I don't care.He came back to India and he actually confessed and he said that's what happened.So you see, it depends.

But why would a KGB secret agent would try to honey trap Indian diplomat because aren't we friends?

Exactly.That's the whole thing.But you see, especially in Soviet Union, it was Iron Curtain.So people really didn't know what was happening in the world.And that time Soviet Union had to send as many agents as they could to different countries to actually really know what's happening in those countries like America, India.Yes, of course, it's a great friendship between, it was Soviet Union and India and now still it's amazing.

Yeah, but still it's nice to have your own agents who actually tell you what's going on in that country, what's the, you know, uh that's the whole idea okay but tell me when did you first realize that you were being trained for something that most people don't even know that it exists i realized that when we were still in the academy and five of us So we were not allowed to discuss about this program, about what we learned, because we learn actually quite crazy stuff as well with anyone, even with our classmates, our other classmates.So only in this little kind of like team.So obviously we were kind of like shocked.in the beginning.and we were talking like you know like kind of like whispering to each other what is this program what's happening you know why do we like why do we study why do we need it so we kind of like realized about that but we have never been taught about the history of it how did it happen and why do we need to know that and why and how exactly we will implement these techniques in the future so Five of us went to different departments then.My department was fighting criminal world.

Some other girls, I know that couple, they were sent abroad.I don't know what happened with them.Obviously, after that time, I really didn't have any connection with them.So I have no idea.And again, if even they would be somewhere, they would have completely different identity, look and names.

Fair, but then was there any point where you realized that, okay, I have to go to some different world.I have to go convince a man or forge a relationship with that person in order to extract information.At what point were you aware that this is what is going to happen?Because you were, you went to the school thinking that I'm going to learn the military skills.I'm going to learn all these different kinds of skills, because now I'm the top five.It's my privilege to learn certain psychological stuff.

Pressure.Pressure.

No pressure at all.Yeah.

They wouldn't tell you upfront and be like, hey, you need to do this, at least in the beginning.At what point did that happen?

I didn't understand that in the beginning when I studied there.Because, again, it was all about education.I honestly was interested about learning self -confidence techniques because when I just got enrolled, first of all, I was a virgin.Second, I was ugly duckling.I was bullied in the school.I was the only one exotic looking girl in the school with all like blondes, blue eyes, beautiful girls.

I didn't have any communication skills.So for me, learning psychological techniques and psychological intelligence were extremely interesting.And it's all about art of communication, first of all.You know, for the girl who doesn't believe in herself, who feels ugly, who doesn't know how to put makeup, who doesn't know how to walk into the room and be a magnet, to be like this beautiful alluring and feminine at the same time, for me it was very useful information.And only when I got to my department and when I started to work with my team on different missions and I was a bait, in these missions, I realized my role and my function.For example, imagine, and especially when I mentioned about the criminal world, I don't know how is it in India, I would like to come, but for example, here in Los Angeles, if you would go to Venice Beach or Santa Monica Beach or like anywhere nearby Hollywood, there's so many homeless people.

but the government provides them food and some other medical insurance.Imagine that time in Russia after the Soviet Union fall, there were like that amount of homeless kids.There were like kids 8, 10, 14 years old on the streets.No food, no medication, nothing.Mostly of them were coming from other post -Soviet Union countries like Tajikistan, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan.And they're quite close to India as well.

And all these kids, they didn't have didn't have anything, like no roof, no food, no nothing.And I think you understand what I'm saying.It's really painful to see.Okay, you understand if it's like an adult and maybe this is his choice, maybe he decides to live like that.But when you see these vulnerable, helpless children, they don't know what to do.They have no adults to help them.

So I was a bait in my team.So we would have this strategy where we would spot and spy on this, let's say, whorehouse or the house they would sell drugs.Also, clients could go and have sex services.So those criminal groups, they would pick up all these children, mostly girls at this young age.Obviously, they would drug them so they wouldn't... uh you know be sort of like active or like understand big sort of unconscious and they would get raped like daily 10 20 times which is one of the most profitable businesses right you sell one time something like for example you sell like one gun or like one gram of cocaine or hearing or whatever this girl can be used multiple times and you can resell her again and again again so it's the most profitable business and we had to establish main...strategies.

For example, when I said I was a bait, and that time I was 18 years old, so I had to pretend that I would be one of the girl, and then eventually the criminal, somebody, criminals would pick me up as a girl on the street, or I would be nearby or something.somebody would bring me, so we would also have undercover agents who would already work with them, pretending that they are drug dealers and buy some drugs and supply them to others and bring money.So we would also establish this connection with this criminal gang.And then, for example, this drug dealer would bring me as another product to sell.So I would be bought and I would be inside in this house and I would check how many girls were there, how many clients would come, how many criminals are there.So together with my team and only with their commitment and it's so important and I wish, I wish people would understand that and I think like this is so important what this job is about.

So together with my team, I don't know exactly, we saved over 500 underage children, but we couldn't save so many others.I imagine that what we could do if there would be more agents like us.

So then this was the time you realized that you're going to do this.You're going to do this work.You're going to be an undercover agent and do all of this.

Well, of course, my commander at that time said, and you know how it is, you start from here, then you do your job, we give you a promotion, then you do your job, we give you another promotion, so eventuallyafter the whole mission, full and the Vladimir mission I'm talking about, my actually commander said, I'll give you a promotion and you now will be working with diplomats and ministers and so on.Of course, I didn't want to do it because it's all the same.I felt like I've been used by my own system.I did believe and for me it was actually like a human trafficking by my own government, you know.

This you realized when you were 18?

I realized it when I was like 21 when I stood in front of my commander when he was telling me all the things and I understood like it doesn't make any sense.What I understood is one, we say like in Russia there is a saying that you cannot fight the evil if you're just by yourself.You need to have a power.And in our world, influence is your power.This is another reason why I'm doing what I'm doing, why I go public, why I tell and share people how to prevent human trafficking, especially after the huge awareness and the huge you know, think what's happening right now after Epstein files, because people finally start to realize what's going on.And it's not just Epstein, I think people start to realize there's so many other groups like that.

And he wasn't doing this by himself.They're like much, much bigger than that.

So I still didn't get the point where, so you said you were a bait.That was one of your missions.What point did somebody tell you that, hey, go be the bait?

Um, every, uh, department for the first time, the first time, every department.So when I just got to my department, every department agents, they have, they divided by teams.So for example, our department, there were like about 40 men.I actually was the only one female in there.Uh, and again, the department, like it's, uh, I was thinking that a day it was so hidden, like, you wouldn't even find it.So it was like underground floor in the actually building of like civilian building.

Got it.

So you wouldn't even, you know, find it.But every department divided by like, you know, team, So in a team about four or five agents and there is one agent who is your leader.So it's kind of like your commander.So he is the brain of the team and he would create the strategy, would give you order what to do.This is your job, this is your job, this is your job.And you would have one person who is sort of like IT guy who would collect all the data, Or for example, we would contact him and say, hey, we spot like we are on the spot, like on the place spying, where like this pretend like whole house could be.

We see this car with this plate number.Can you please check who this car belongs to?Everything.So he would find all the information and give it to us, because at that time we didn't have smartphones and we didn't have access to the Internet, only the office did.So he was sort of like you.And he would give us like the address, the marital status, the former criminal cases, if he had all the information.

So you have also like this, let's say, Q guy.like in James Bond, like the Q guy, then you have the commander, the leader who actually every morning, every evening would give you you know, the strategist step by step.So you have to report to him and then he would report to the main commander of the department.And then we would have like three agents, like for example, I'm the bait, then two would be my backup.So for example, I would go there and do this, they would back me up or like help me or so it was like a teamwork all the time.

Got it.But when you were given an assignment, what were you told?What did they tell you?What are you supposed to do?

They wouldn't tell me, just go and be the bait, of course.

Exactly, like what would they tell you?

Okay, so here is the simple thing.So we have this criminal gang operating with selling heroin, for example, and also potential human trafficking, like human labor, sex labor.We want to establish, first of all, where does it happen?How many people do that?How many people involved?How many kidnapped and how much drugs have been sold.

So then my leader of my team would go and create with us, I mean, the strategy how to find out about this.So sometimes it would take months to prepare and understand how many people there, who's coming in, who's coming out, like what's happening there, like what's the inner circle, what's the, you know, we would have also, which is, I think, like everybody use this kind of people.He was a former uh drug addicted person but he literally looked like druggy but he would work with us so in the end of the day we would pay him a lotwe would give him food or sometimes drugs.So he would go and pretend that he's just a buyer.So he would go to that spot with marked money, which you cannot see, but with the special light, the purple light, you can see that it's marked.

So we would mark this cash, give it to him, and the moment he would exchange cash with the drug, that moment we would arrest the whole thing.We would have also additional two witnesses.and we would just initiate the whole thing and that was also the moment where we could come inside and see what's happening there sometimes i get that how the mission is happening i'm not able to get who told you to become the bait the my leader i mean the leader of my okay so he would like come specifically and be like hey you need to be one of these homeless people yeah yeah and be the bait and go inside homeless like be like this girl for for them to potential buyer so that they can buy you.So I didn't look like a buyer.So this guy was like, I look like a girl who could be bought.Yes.

So you and then these mafia, these, like, these sort of illegal groups and cartels, they would, they would get you in, and you would be inside their, their house where they're keeping all these illegal girls.Right.And then you said, those Those women will be tortured, raped, maybe sold to people.

Sometimes overdosed.

Sometimes overdosed.Like, were you not worried that they would do the same thing to you?

Of course I was worried.Are you kidding me?I was like, every moment I was like thinking, Oh my God, this is my last day.Of course.

Did they do anything to you?Did they drug you?

Of course they did.And like, I actually had a huge problem, which I'm not really happy to speak about it, but like I was at some point I was in a relationship.it took me years years and hard work with therapies to actually get out from that trap it's really bad some some drugs once you try it like you can i was worried that i may caught like aids like at this i mean like seriously it's like and what inside you were like that hey i'm ready to work as I'm ready to be drugged.

I'm ready to work as a sex worker.I'm ready to be sold.I'm ready to do all of these things.Like, what inside you made you believe that I am doing all of this for my nation's pride or something?

Have you seen eyes of those kids who are, like, who don't have any future?Like, have you seen eyes of those kids, like, who are just, they are just trapped?And there is no one in the world who can help them apart from you.And if you need to sacrifice your body for this, wouldn't you do it?You know how many kids I saw, like, who...Sorry, it's really emotional, just...

You know, when I speak about kids, and I'm also a mother, the amount of children we've seen, I've seen in particular, and when we would come, it was too late.They were already dead.And these little dead bodies, this is something, you know, it's just, it's my nightmare.I cannot even sleep properly, because when I go there, it's...It's hard.It's like pain of my soul, you know, and that's why with everything I do and I try to make it even bigger and when I do public speaking, I speak about anti -human trafficking.

and techniques and tools, how to prevent it.Because I believe that if parents would check on their children, especially online, with whom they speak online, what's happening online, and if they would be also like teaching them to be careful with any type of adults or with whom they speak online because you never know maybe it's a fake account and there is like a pervert or pedophile over there and teach children I think that would it would save a lot of children and I believe in prevention so of course I was scared but when I've seen myself this 10, 8, 14 years old girls and they would some of them when we would rescue them and we would bring them to the department I remember they had wounds like with blood that they couldn't even take out the clothes or do anything because of the enormous amount of injections into their inner thighs because obviously they couldn't be injected you know here it's terrible what's happening in the world it's terrible and I just I just want to parents, you know, adults to know about this and protect their children, but not just their children, every children.

You've said that they wanted pretty women, but not too pretty women.

Yeah.

Right.So what were they exactly looking for?What kind of psychological profile were they looking for?be trying to recruit?Because you just said out of 40 men, there was one woman and out of all those women also, there were only five who were being selected for a special program.So what kind of psychological profile they were looking for specifically?

In fact, I had a nickname which was exotic, which is like understandable.All the girls were different.One had this look like, you know, black hair, white pale skin, tall.Another had like ginger hair and like white skin, right?So in other words, blonde blue eyes.So they would, it wasn't about being super sexy or beautiful.

It was about, first of all, it wasn't even about the look.It's all about your charisma.How can you present yourself and also your emotional level?Can you tolerate some things?Can you tolerate scenes that may ruin you?So we've been, and again, like it's about maybe, about like 10 maybe students were giving those tests, but only five were left because not also everybody could go through all the tests because they were quite hard.

And it's not about physical pressure.We would wake up at 6 a .m.to like do all the physical activities, just like running for a few kilometers, like gun shooting, like martial art.I mean, like, it's not a joke.It was really hard.

plus homework, you have to study a lot.I remember I was sleeping, so I would go in the end of the room and I was like sleeping.sometimes because like, I mean, I was exhausted.And there is no ideal look.It's all about your intelligence level and the physics you have, and also about your principles, which is very important.Are you, can you lie?

Can you create another legend?Can you act?Because again, like if you are undercover agent, you supposed to do all of these things, be an actor.

But how, what's that one quality they would identify and how would they identify this from the outside?Because can you lie or can you be charismatic?Are you intelligent?These are the skills that are, qualities they would find out much later.

Yeah, I think the most important is how quick can you move and shift yourself to another identity.How quick can you adapt?

Can you be a comedian?

Yeah, like you must be and you must be able to adapt so quick.Okay, because sometimes you don't have a second chance.So I think this is the most important thing.Because again, as I said, like agents, there's so many like different directions, the agents could work in the field agents could work in the department.And again, like, it's not about like, If you're super smart, you probably wouldn't be in the field because they would give you much better tasks in the office to collect information, do the research, do different strategies and all that.Field agents are the ones who

yeah, who would be perfect actors, but also good communicators.

There was a, I was reading about it, that Soviet Union ran a literal school, which was State School 4 in Kazan.

That's what they said in the book.

Yeah, exactly.To train women as sexual agents.The place that you went, where you earned your diploma, Would that be some sort of that school or was it different?

Yes, it was the same.I would say I have never been in Kazan school.I don't know about Kazan school, I've never been there, but I suppose it's a similar program.Why?Because I happened to speak with some of them.Like over time you work, I did work with some different active female agents.

And they would also talk about a similar way of school.Where did they study?How did it go there?And we would find some similarities or some differences.But I cannot tell because this is classified information, but I can tell you 100 % that there are much more schools than you can imagine.

So here's the last question.if you've spoken about a lot of things the last question is it's it's a follow -up on the question that i asked you all right yes what did you analyze about me in these hours that we spent which will make me an easy target an easy target yeah or maybe something which will help you manipulate me easily i mean i cannot be so i

my god this is uh this is hard question rush or whatever whatever you just analyze psychologically let's let's psychologically because obviously um i don't want to manipulate you because there is no reason to manipulate you because i don't want you i don't want anything from you fair So manipulators, they only manipulate the victim when they want something from the victim, right?So we don't have like this situation here.So I would say like, what's the psychological portrait?Okay, perfect.So first of all, you love to learn, you're very curious.And everything you do, especially this podcast, you educate yourself, but you also want to educate other people, particularly same -age men in India, because you want them to be more successful and develop successful skills.

Yeah, men the men's same age.Yes.

Yes.Yes.I mean, like if you're talking like about you and how you are the role model for your audience, because I actually went to some of your videos and I scrolled and read 3000 comments at some videos because I was genuinely curious about who are your audience, what do they take from your podcast, what do they learn?And there's so many young people who you are the role model for them, and hence you feel responsible for any information you give in your podcast, in your social media, because you feel responsible as sort of like mentor, you want to give back to the society.which is incredible.And the good thing that I think in India in particular, it's a developing country and they are developing so fast for the last 10 -20 years.

If they will go ahead like that, they could become simply the first country in the world.Yes, but the most important word is like education, information, knowledges, and that's exactly what you do for your audience, which is incredible.I think that, I mean, according to some questions, that you are very innocent, you know, like you would be a really easy target.like no it's just because like when we were speaking and I would say now you're blushing when we were speaking about some seduction or like intimate techniques whatever was telling you that moment I could see your facial expressions and I could see that you genuinely were like interested because you didn't know about that So and also in a sense in some of the when we spoke about manipulation also like oh you know this is also happening this is also like what is you know what what can be so you have to be careful so this is also another thing you're very friendly very open because during the whole conversation I don't know how long was it how many hours but you're very open and uh right now you just have like this this is always like my either this or i'm just like this it's okay yeah but overall your body uh and like the wholeimpression, everything is very open and very friendly, which of course helps anyone who speaks with you, because you connect yourself with your person, with the interviewer.So this is also great.

Another thing...Of course, you're very intelligent, and you ask me a lot of great questions.I love that.And I hope it would be very meaningful information.And you have compassion for people.Because when I said about the human trafficking and what I've seen, I could see in your eyes that you understand what I'm talking about.

Maybe you saw similar scenes in India.Maybe, like, you heard some stories about that but I could see the compassion and it's very important because when I would share or like you would share something very intimate because this is very intimate to me that's why I became emotional because it's very you know it's painful for my heart I could see that you um morally like support me so you you you understand what I'm talking about so this is about compassion the human compassion uh which is also great and you're a good listener and a good student because you want to learn, right?And that's how you develop yourself.You want to learn and that's why you ask me some questions which is not even in your notebook.Something like, oh, how does this work?Which is great.

This is amazing.But you asked me if you would be easily manipulated.I don't think so.I think, you know what?um skill of everyone.can develop is to analyze.

So you're not that emotional person when I say like, this is great, buy it now, get it now.You wouldn't run and do it.So I see that you're very analytical, which is good and logical.So you would give yourself time to analyze.digest, understand, and make a decision, which is perfect, you would be a perfect spy.Maybe you're coming from the road to check on me.

But you said I can be an easy target.So next time if I see some woman seven times in the favorite color that I have, I should be aware of.I was like, Hello, I know where you're coming from.Don't do this.

Absolutely.I learned that this is a honey trap technique.Yeah, but compliments.If somebody compliments you a lot, this is the red flag.

Yeah, I'll be careful.

Be careful with compliments.

Well, thank you so much.

It was a pleasure having you.Thank you so much.I really appreciate it.

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