The Hidden Danger in Rice and Wheat: Focus Issues, Iron Loss & Anemia | Ravinder | FO502 Raj Shamani

If a child eats normal crops like rice, wheat, etc, what happens to his brain?

The most important thing is that when you don't have iron, your brain doesn't get blood circulation, it doesn't get oxygen.If you don't have zinc, your growth stops.Stunted kids don't reach their potential height.They remain mentally stunted.

What impact will it have on me now that I'm a grown person?

When you have iron deficiency, your focus goes away.Then you feel fatigued.50 years ago, when my father or my grandfather used to eat roti, they used to get 56 % zinc from it.Today, it's less than half.

What happened is that the roti that was 50 years ago was nutritious.It's not today.

Now, 40 % of India's soil is deficient in zinc.What's the other thing?The seed in the soil.There used to be a lot of nutrition in the old varieties.Now, there's no nutrition in the new varieties.The third theft is happening at the factory level.

Now, if you see, everything we have is going into the packet.What happens in ultra processed food is that 30 -40 % of the nutrients go there.The fourth and last thing is in our plate, which is the most dangerous.Earlier, if you see, humans used to eat 6 ,000 types of plants.Today, if you see, there are 30 types of plants that are 70 -80 % of our food.And if you talk about India, there are only three crops that are giving us 70 % calories.

Rice, wheat, maize.

Normally, whenever we talk about health or fitness, we only focus on diet, calories and the gym.We feel that that if we have fulfilled our protein requirements and are working out every day, then we are perfectly fit.But there is a big gap that we are missing.that how essential minerals are disappearing from our food, due to which our body is becoming internally weak.Our today's guest is working on this missing gap.I'm talking about Ravinder Grover, COO of Harvest Plus Solutions.

In this conversation, we will learn from him, why is zinc and nutrition decreasing in today's food?What is this hidden hunger?And how is it making us weak from within?And what are the early signs of micronutrients deficiency that we mostly ignore?To know more about Harvest Plus Solutions and the Nutri Patshala initiative, check the link in the description.In simple words, tell me what is the main work?

First of all, what is happening in India right now?

We are producing 330 million tons of food at present.And the food is tasty too.We have done a lot of processing, we have made it shine, it looks beautiful too, nowadays food comes in 10 minutes.So, we are fat food secure.But the biggest problem that is going on is daylight robbery, nutrition heist.When we were doing Zumba from our plate, going to the gym, drinking protein shake, someone came from behind and stole the nutrition from our plate.

So, that is the biggest problem.And we are trying to solve that.Let me give you an example.50 years ago, when my father or my grandfather used to eat roti, they used to get 56 % zinc from it.Guess how much they get today?

Same roti?10%, 20 %?

25%, yes.It's less than half.It's less than half.It's the same story with rice.

It's a story of catching them that we are doing.Tell me what happened?What happened that the bread that was 50 years ago was nutritious, not today?

There are four main reasons.There is theft in four places.Let's start from the beginning.The food is made.Our journey starts with the soil.We put seeds in the soil.

The crop comes out of the seeds and the crop goes ahead and then our process comes in our plate and we eat it.This is a whole cycle.In the soil, 40 % of India's soil is zinc deficient.40%.So think about it, if there is no zinc in the soil, it won't pass on.Organic carbon should generally be in the soil up to 5%.

That's 0 .5%.Organic carbon means its life.That is only 0 .5 % in our country.Why did this happen?How did the soil deteriorate?When we brought the green revolution, we started growing more and started intensive agriculture.

The ratio of fertilizers is skewed towards nitrogen.We use less micronutrient fertilizers.So those are the reasons.The use of bio -fertilizers was less.So those are the reasons that compounded and the condition of our soil became thinner.Okay.

So the soil is less now.

Soil is degraded.We can't grow anything in it.This is a big problem.This was the first story of the soil.What is the second story?The seed in the soil.

When the green revolution came in the seed, our only focus was to grow as much as possible.possible.So, what did we do in that process?First, we used to breed the seed normally.When we started doing it after the Green Revolution, we started breeding it for yield.We didn't pay attention to anything else.

There was no focus on whether the nutrition was decreasing or increasing, whether there were climate traits or not.There was only one focus, that first, if the yield of wheat was 2 tons, how would I get 6 tons?So, we had only one focus on that.So, according to that...At that time, the need was the same.The need was the same.

So, but what happened in that process?We left the focus on nutrition.So, as I told you, in our seeds, up to 30 % nutrition was reduced because of that.So, that is the second biggest reason that we have seeds.There used to be a lot of nutrition in old varieties.There is no nutrition in the new varieties.

The third theft is happening at your factory level.Now this food is ready.Now it has gone to the factories.Earlier, our food was minimally processed.There was a lot of processing at home.Rice milling was done, wheat flour was made.

Now, if you look at it, everything is going into the packet, going towards ultra -processed food.What happens in ultra -processed food is that 30 -40 % nutrients go there.What is their purpose there?They are not being made for ultra -processed food, but to give you nutrition.They are being made for how to be standardized in factories.Flour is easy to standardize in factories compared to whole wheat.

Or how to eat again and again, like we call hyper -palatability.Adjust the ratio of salt, sugar, and fat in such a way which you call bliss point engineering, that your multiple reward systems will be activated in the brain.You pick up one bar, you pick up another one, you pick up another one, repeat purchase, sale.It is made for that purpose.

Bliss point engineering.I have never heard of it.What is it?

So, the receptors in our brain respond to a ratio of food.What is the ratio of salt, sugar and fat?They can be different combinations.A combination of sugar and fat.You will see that in some products, sugar and fat are more.In some, salt and fat are more.

The point is to make such a point, to make such a recipe that you eat and your brain thinks that this is the best food.Then it will pick up one more.Then it will pick up one more.It will be very palatable.You will never get satiety.So, your stomach will never be full.

It will not be full.

The body will keep asking for more.So, there our nutrition was stolen again.

It's called bliss point engineering.So, all the food companies do it?

To some extent, yes.Even if you are making a good product, you have to do it.See, why do you choose a product?We live in the real world.You have to make people taste it.But the thing is, Some companies will do it so that a good product tastes good.

Some will do it so that the product is good, but it should taste good.

So, that's one difference.But ultimately, they want it to be so good that it becomes so addictive that it keeps getting sold.

Yes, no one will eat cardboard.So, you have to make a good product.The fourth and last thing is in our plate, which is the most dangerous.Earlier, if you see, humans used to eat 6000 plant species.They used to eat 6000 types of plants.If you see today, there are 30 types of plants that are 70 -80 % of our food.

And if you talk about India, there are only 3 crops that are giving us 70 % calories.Rice, wheat, maize.So we can say that yes, carbs are bad, don't eat carbs.But the reality is, you can't talk about nutrition without getting an angle of affordability.Our calories come from there.If you go to our public distribution system, our ration system, there you can see that 90 % of your ration is distributed in two crops.

rice and wheat.1 % is millets, even after celebrating the International Year of Millets.And there is another reason for this, there is no need to blame anyone, there is another reason for this, and that is affordability.Like I tell everyone, Whatever nutrition intervention you propose, keep in mind that he will eat three times in 100 rupees after that intervention.Because this is our reality.200 rupees is our daily income.

And after paying the rent and other expenses, 100 rupees is left for food per person.So the person who said, Apple a day keeps the doctor away, he didn't know the price of apples.Apples cost 200 rupees a kilo.You blink it, four apples will come.How can a family of four afford it?They only have one thing to eat, rice and wheat.

So, in our plate, the theft started happening.In the 60s, we used to have 20 % millets in our plate.Today we have 5%.Everything else started disappearing.Fermented food started disappearing.

Pickles, chutneys, everything is disappearing slowly.

So, our plate, which used to be called the rainbow color, What is the problem?is still deprived.Your stomach got food, but the cells are craving.Zinc deficiency, iron deficiency, protein deficiency.So these deficiencies, our calorie intake is complete.We are eating because the calories are coming from there, which we are eating.

But this is not.What is the result of that?If you look at India, there are 57 % children who have anemia.57%.We are making Chandrayaan.67 % women have anemia.

If there are three ladies in our office, they have two chronic diseases.And people don't even know about it until they have advanced symptoms.And that's why it's called hidden hunger.So this is the biggest problem.And it's not just a health problem.There is a huge economic loss.

Countries are spending up to 12 % of their GDP to fight this.There is a loss.If you have young people, we talk about demographic advantage, we talk about dividends, that if India moves forward and our generation is young, we will get dividends.If you think about it, those children are sick.So that demographic dividend is going to turn into a demographic penalty.So that is the biggest problem we are facing.

The hidden hunger is very widespread.And it is not even visible.People think that we have eaten, we are satisfied.So it's going well.But this is the problem.And this has a practical impact.

Because of zinc deficiency, children remain stunted.

They don't grow.

35 % of our children are stunted here.Stunted means not only their physical growth, but also their mental growth.So many of them wanted to become cricketers, influencers, podcasters.So we didn't give them a fair chance.They remained mentally stunted because of zinc deficiency.Iron Deficiency

as I told you, is very important for the brain.Iron is like the battery of our phone.If you don't get iron, your brain doesn't get oxygen, you won't be able to focus, you won't have cognitive development.So kids can't focus.Kids don't have mental growth because of iron deficiency, they get anemia.So this, particularly the kids and women, they are having the biggest impact because of this hidden hunger.

Men, don't they?No, it happens to men.But because of their biology, they tend to lose blood.So, anemia affects them more.They go through pregnancy.And it is harmful for children at the growth stages.

It does permanent damage.

How do you fix this?

There are two ways to fix this.We believe that our food system is broken and scattered.There can be two ways to fix this.One, you can repair it.bring something external, like we are trying to do.We are adding vitamin A or D synthetically in milk, which is called fortification.

We added iodine in salt.

Second, the medicine you take.Supplements.But how will you fix this?You are saying that you will make the entire country's crop better.You will repair it, you will fix it.How do you fix it?

So I said that we talked about the point of repairing, right?That we can bring supplements, we can bring fortification.

What is fortification?

Fortification is like when we add pre -mixes in food.Like in milk, we add vitamin A and vitamin D at the stage of processing.People drink milk, so they get vitamin A and vitamin D. Again, it is a kind of synthetic product and it has a recurring cost.Every time you are doing it, you have to add it.is another approach that we work on.That approach is different.

It works on healing.One could be repair and the other could be healing.What is healing?As it is written in our Bhagavad Gita that internal transformation is the core principle.True.I can fight a lot of things if I transform internally.

So there is such a possibility in our seed that we can transform the seed internally.As we say in yoga, we can awaken its kundalini.We can awaken a dormant energy inside it.We can uncoil it.So basically we will upgrade the seed's software.So that when you get a crop from that seed, there is nutrition in the crop, it automatically flows into the whole food system.

Once you have made such a seed, it continues for years.So, this approach is low cost.So, it has a slightly heavy name, Biofortification.The name is very scary because it is given by a scientist.But the concept is very simple.The concept is that, as we were talking, the old seeds, There used to be old crops, they had nutrition.

Today's crops have 2 times, even 3 times more nutrition than the old varieties.Today's variety has yield.Now I bring both of them and get them married.Old and new.Old and new.I got them married.

Now they have children.Some of their children will have a little more yield, a little more nutrition.Mixing has started naturally.So, scientists keep doing this for 7 -8 years.And after 7 -8 years, you get such a variety, you get such a baby, which is also in nutrition.and yield.

There are some kids who are ahead in studies, in mischief, in everything, even in sports.So you get such kids all around us.So that is the concept of biofortification.

But you said two things.First, you have to do it for 7 -8 years.So it will be a long process.It will take 8 -10 years to do biofortification.That is one.Second is, if you do it so many times, if you look for it, if you mix it, it will cost a lot of money.

So when it becomes so expensive, then again, affordability is out of the park.

So biofortification is not that expensive.One reason for that is that you have to look at the system cost.In other approaches, you spend every time.In biofortification, you have to spend at the research level.And the good part is, Biofortification is not a start -up idea.It's not a French science.

It's not today's idea.Research has been going on for 30 years.And in 30 years, more than 400 varieties have already been released in 40 countries.So we already have the technology.We have already built such varieties.For example, in India, there is Zinc Wheat, Iron -rich Bajra, Iron -rich Rice.

ICR, our National Agricultural Research System, has released 120 varieties of biofortified crops.

So it's already happening.How expensive is it on average?

It's not expensive at all.Because there is no additional expense.The farmer doesn't have to follow any new practice.Like they grow their own food.Like they grow their own seeds.They get the seeds at the same price.

And they don't have to do anything new.But the seeds, normal seeds and bio -fortified seeds will be different, right?It's a variety of seeds.But it's expensive.No, it's not expensive.It's the same price.

Then who's paying for it?The cost has already been paid.The bill for this food has already been paid.Half a billion dollars have already been invested in this bio -fortification.Let me tell you its backstory.In the 90s, there was an economist, Dr. Haworth Boyce.

He was out of Stanford.Because he was an economist, he got an idea that we are spending so much money on supplementation and fortification program every year.People are eating only rice and wheat.So why don't we build nutrition in this?So this was his idea in the 90s.So, obviously, whenever you come up with such an idea, at that time, nutrition was considered calories.

So, when you come up with such an idea, there is a pushback.So, people went to many places and said that it is not possible.So, they talked to many science institutes.So, the solution was that yes, it is possible.After that, Then came the problem of funding.Now who will fund it?

The theory is possible, but where will the funding come from?So for that, he used to go to the agriculturalists.They used to say that this is the job of the nutritionists.He used to go to the nutritionists and say that the agriculturalists will do it.So long story short, he got the funding.He did a lot of work.

And then in 1993, a challenge program was set up on biofortification.That program ran for 10 years.In 2003, the program got so big that it had to give the name of a different organization, Harvest Plus.And he was the founder of it.Plus.And for his work, he won the World Food Prize in 2016, which is the food equivalent of the Nobel Prize.

In 2016, our Prime Minister also felicitated him by inviting him to India.So, work has already been done on this.30 years of work has been done on this.There were a few more interesting things in that journey.When we were doing this work, many people said that you will have to generate very strong evidence for this.So one more good thing that happened was that 15 years of evidence was created.

in which Cornell, UC Davis, Johns Hopkins, all the reputed universities and colleges, and the gold standard of research called RCTs, Randomized Controlled Trials, more than 20 randomized controlled trials were done.Three things were proved in all of them.The first point was, is zinc and iron actually increasing in these crops?The second was, if it is increasing, is it bioavailable or not?Will the body be able to take it or not?The third was, if it is being absorbed, will it have an impact or not?

So, the resounding yes from the 20 -year evidence that was generated, the answer came out that yes, this concept works, it has absorption, And this creates an impact.There have been a lot of studies.There have been a lot in India too.In India, in Maharashtra, children were fed on an iron -rich padra.So, their iron deficiency started reversing by 64%.In how many years?

Three months.And similarly, in Delhi, New Delhi, a study was done on zinc wheat.I think they were fed zinc wheat twice.It was a three to six month study.I'm forgetting the exact time.In that, his pneumonia days reduced by 17 % and his vomiting days also reduced by more than 40 % So the kids who couldn't go to school due to sick days, they were reversed.

Similarly, in Zambia, what I personally find very interesting is that there was a lot of deficiency of vitamin A. So there, women were fed a vitamin A -rich maize.And vitamin A maize was increased in their breast milk.So how does the impact of food pass on from mother to children?

But what is the problem now?Like what's, what's the problem that you're facing?And as much as a seed of your normal Bajra will be, the same price will be of your Bajra, right?

Fortified Bajra.

Then where is the problem now?

The problem now is of scale.

Okay.If the price is not the problem, then why are people not buying?People are buying.

60 crore people are growing and eating biofortified crops today.589 million people.

Nearly 60 crore people.are ahead Crops?Seeds?

Yes and no.The reason for that is that Harvest Plus has never focused on rich countries because we are a not -for -profit.In Nigeria, like Nigeria is a very big success story, there is 22 % vitamin A maize.

And how much do we have here?

We will be in single digit.Similarly, if you go to Kenya, there is a crop, iron beans, like we eat kidney beans, there are more iron kidney beans, that 13 % is its market share.

So, how far is India?What do you think?Now we have so many ministries, so much awareness problem, you are talking about money, which is almost same, yield is almost same, then the major problems are solved.Now it's I think policy and awareness problem.

India is only one decision away from being a biofortification superpower of the world.

What is that decision?

Give 10 % incentive to the farmers for growing biofortified varieties over the normal varieties.

Who will pay the cost for the 10 %?

If you see, you are losing 4 % GDP, it will be much less than what you will spend on it.And this is not the first time we have done this.We introduced MSP at the time of the Green Revolution so that more people grow rice wheat.We have given MSP to reduce the imports of pulses.Oilseed has been given for self -sufficiency.See, farmers don't respond to the presentation.

Farmers respond to the price signal.The day that price signal goes away, a big push will be created there.It will be supply -driven scaling.There is no grain that grows in India and is not eaten.So if you grow more in some way, then it will automatically go into the food system.See, as an organization, our interest is not to make biofortification a concept that only the ultra -elite can afford.

This is an approach for the masses.If it works at the population level, then affordability is a very big factor.Affordability will only come when there is production in bulk and consumption in bulk.So we are one decision away.

The day that decision is made...But it's a chicken and egg problem, right?It's like you are saying that there is a 4 % loss in GDP.So you give 10 % incentive here.Now the question is, if we give 10 % incentive, how will we get immediate funds for it?And if immediate funds are given to our 50 other priorities, then at what time will my country get a growth of 4 %?

What will happen?Like it's a, it's a chicken and egg problem.When do we do first?What do we do first?

I think there are a lot of questions on this.There has been research that shows the cost of good health.How much loss are we making by not doing this?If we look at this in a direct one -to -one benefit, the data from Copenhagen shows that when you invest $1 in biofortification, you get $17 as a system.return.

How?

In your productivity, your health expenses that you are doing, in providing protection to people, all those expenses are reduced to $17, you get 17 times its return, system return.

Explain in a simple language, if there is a child, that child eats normal seed, grown from normal crop, which is your Rice, wheat, he eats that.Right.Which has no nutrients.And they are spoiled today.So what happens to his brain?What is the deficiency due to which his brain cannot develop?

Or what is the problem in his growth?

The most important thing, first let's talk about iron.When there is a deficiency of iron.Iron, I told you, is the battery of our phone.It takes oxygen to the brain.When you don't have iron, then your brain blood circulation is not going, your oxygen is not going.And the growing brain is a nutrition -hungry machine.

It has a weight of 2 % of our body, but it eats 20 % of the energy.So at that time, in its growth years, if there is this deficiency, then cognitive development is very seriously impacted by iron.The second important thing is thinking ability.Children are not able to focus on thinking ability.So, you changed the learning outcomes of that year and decided what it was going to be in the future.So, you changed its future by not giving nutrition at the right time.

Zinc is like our Wi -Fi.It runs a lot of apps in our body.If there is no Wi -Fi, the apps will shut down.Think of it as a network.If there is no network, all the apps will shut down.What are the apps?

Immunity, subscription.component.Zinc brings immunity.You must remember when Covid happened, all the other medicines were prescribed along with a Zincovid tablet.Because zinc is needed for building your immunity.The biggest app that our body is running.

Then zinc runs an app for growth.If there is no zinc, your growth stops.Stunted.stunting.As we saw, 35 % of children do not reach their natural potential height.They remain mentally stunted.

Cognitively, they cannot develop.So, your immunity comes from there.Growth comes from there.Your skin.I mean, zinc has thousands of factors on which it works.Skin.

Your skin problems.Diarrhea is associated with zinc deficiency.Particularly, zinc deficiency impacts children at a very high level.So, the opportunity to grow, to become something in life, if there are nutrition deficiencies, they are seriously impacted.And what impact will it have on me now that I am a grown person?So, like I said, all those apps you also need, right?

You need to glow.You need to grow.You need to have immunity.So, all those things...Same rules apply.But my growth won't be stunted, right?

Yes, you won't have that much impact on it because you are out of that growth state.But you won't get the benefits of the other impacts of Zinc.

Interesting.And if...Somebody listens to this and even after that he thinks that I should change my diet or the food that comes to my house, why shouldn't I do it, what does it mean, it doesn't matter to me.So in the next 5 -10 years, immediate next 5 -10 years, what are the consequences that person is facing?Or at least accepting that this is the situation.

First of all, your fatigue goes away.It's a battery -related condition.When your battery is down, your mood also goes away.What is relevant for today's people is that you can never be happy without micronutrients.Because serotonin, dopamine, you know, all of these are brought by micronutrients.So, you can't be happy by watching motivational videos.

You have to bring micronutrients in your body.So, and I told you about zinc, that all these key apps are its precursor.In fact, the protein that you eat, Zinc and iron are two very strong friends of protein.Even if you eat protein, it doesn't metabolize in the body if there is no zinc and iron.So, all three of them are strong friends of each other.It works the other way around too.

If you are eating zinc and iron and there is no protein, then there is no absorption.But, let's talk about the food matrix.If you eat any nutrient, It has a very strong relationship with all its other nutrients.Someone is absorbing it, someone is transporting it.So, as a matrix, we need to keep it complete.Otherwise, we call it the law of limiting factors.

What is the law of limiting factors?The abundance that you have will not decide your performance.What is not there will decide.

Interesting.

So this happens in the body as well?Yes, exactly.So if you have protein, you have reached a sweet spot.You won't get much benefit from eating more protein.If you don't have iron, it's doing your performance down.If you don't have zinc, it's doing your performance down.

Until and unless you find that store as well.

Tell me, there is a lot of emphasis on protein all of a sudden in India, which is a good thing.But you said something, right?You are emphasizing more on protein, which is problematic.

We need to have protein.And the reason for that is, the surprising thing is, in India, 70 % calories come from the rice wheat maize.50 % protein is also coming from there.So if you have such a big dependence on cereals, and then you reduce your plate, then there is pressure on your protein, plus the vegetarianism and other things.There is inadequacy and it affects.But there is a paradox in protein.

Paradox is that generally the people who need it the most, the elderly, the rural population, they either don't know about it or they don't have the money.And those who are okay, they have an obsession with it.So people are going into trauma that their protein is not getting fulfilled.So both things are going on here.

Those who know, they are in trauma.Those who don't know, they don't even care.They don't even care that protein is needed.

They are still not convinced.There are a lot of people in my house who are not able to convince that protein is needed.So this is one protein paradox that exists.Second, I think protein is slowly becoming a health detergent.What do you mean by that?So we are fixated on it, on protein.

Take any bad food product and write 12 grams in front of it.Suddenly it starts looking healthy.Health washing is happening.Protein washing is happening for everything.And one more problem I have is that now protein is coming in everything.Protein came in coffee, protein came in your chips.

It will come in samosas someday.In flour too.We have protein in everything.So I think there will be such a stage that People will forget about the tracking of how much they are eating.They will start hitting the upper limit.

What is wrong in this?No matter how much you eat, at this point, India's diet is such that it's very difficult to overdose it.

But it's expensive.You're flushing your money also out.After a limit, its utilization is also there.So those who are affording it, they can do it.Yes.

I'm sure those who are eating protein from chocolate to flour, they are the ones who can afford it.Let them.

Yes.If you're only eating protein, then probably it might not be correct.Because, see, protein, Again, I said nutrition is an orchestra.You can't fixate on one nutrient.You have Abhishek Sharma, a very explosive batsman.You can't win only the World Cup with his confidence.

You need Sanju Samson, you need Hardik Pandya, you need Boombra.If you want to win the World Cup, you have to do all this.So, it is like that.So, if you are eating protein, what happens many times is that the rest of the things are being ignored.For example, there is no focus on micronutrients.Now, protein has become a proxy for health.

Like I told you, pick up any product and write 12 grams on it.The picnic has started.Now, what was left in it?Is there fiber in it or not?Is there micronutrient in it or not?There is no focus on it.

So, attention is grabbing all the protein.And it has become a sole indicator of health.

And this problem of India, this is our biggest problem.

problem of ours.You know, we can increase our nutrition by up to 5 times only in the kitchen.Only in the kitchen, by doing small things.

Like?

I have a framework, which I call Fuss.I say, create a little fuss in the kitchen.Get a little fussy in the kitchen.The first magical technique, by the way, these are all old techniques, nothing new in it.Fermentation.It is very underrated.

It's a very good system.It can increase your nutrition by 2 to 4 times.Idli, Dosa.There's a drink in the North called Kanji.When you ferment it, the phytates, the antinutrients of any food are released.Its nutrition increases by 2 to 5 times just by fermenting.

Second, use whole food.

If you can eat it, don't throw anything.If you can't eat it, it's a different thing.People are making banana skin curry.In Kerala, in West Bengal, in Assam, banana peels are used as a vegetable.

Okay, that's weird, but okay.

Use all.Eat things with peels.Like you're making paneer at home, you knead the water in the flour.You're eating watermelon, we only eat watermelon.And the seeds of watermelon are so good, you roast them.The rind of the watermelon is used as a vegetable.

So, before today, very few parts were thrown away.The reason for that is, that the nutrition in cereals is mostly in the top part.So when you peel it off or throw away its parts, then you minus the nutrition from it.So use whole foods as much as you can.You have chana, you have lentils.As soon as you soak all of these, its phytates are released.

Sprouting, you know, sprouting has activation.In fact, sprouting is the best because new vitamins are also made in it.Because a new plant starts growing from the seed.So if you are doing soaking and sprouting, then you are unlocking nutrition.Last is switch.You have to rotate the food.

Our grandparents did not eat the same food.Five types of lentils were made in five days.fixate on their preferences and eat the same kind of food, which is why they don't rotate.So, there are two benefits of that.When you rotate food, a different kind of fiber is going.Your gut microbiome is a bit of a touristy type.

It wants to see different places, different things.So, if you do these four things, you first create in a small kitchen, you do small things and You can increase your nutrition by 2 to 5 times without any effort.Your budget has been saved.There is a bonus on this.What?Surya Namaskar.

Many people are not able to do Surya Namaskar.Do you know why?Vitamin D deficiency in India.Some surveys say 70%, some say up to 90%.But there is a lot of deficiency of vitamin D. But if you can't do Surya Namaskar, then make your food Surya Namaskar.What do you mean by that?

When we eat mushrooms, like our skin, sunlight vitamin d mushroom skin sunlight vitamin d

didn't get it.

You can google about it.So, a good vitamin D pill will be made.It has vitamin D2.The time we get from the sunlight is D3.D3 is a little more powerful, but D2 also works.Okay.

So, but you can only make your mushrooms do Surya Namaskar.

And what other foods can we make?

There is research on mushrooms, which I have knowledge of.And there are a lot of commercial companies that do commercial sunlight treatment for mushrooms, sun -soaked mushrooms.So, there are small tricks that you can do 5 to 50 times in the kitchen.So, the kitchen is where you can fight the fight for nutrition.

Tell me, what are the early signs that a person sees inside himself and is avoiding?which will eventually cause some major health problem.And that is due to missing early signs of micronutrients.

Fatigue, focus.You know, we think it is due to stress.A lot of times people keep thinking, why is he not getting it?Why is he not paying attention?Why is he so distracted?Just like there is a fashion these days to call Gen Z, he is very distracted.

It has become a favorite topic of people.So, a lot of times it's the micronutrients that are the problem.

Is it just asking a hypothetical question?monthly, yeah, quarterly injections.Because that's a fashion and a very tier one top of the level people, right?Have you seen that?

I have seen, I've seen IV drips and all that.Like I said, I don't come from that profession.So I don't know the exact science and how does it work.But given a choice, I will rather prefer the food for the benefits it brings.Like I said, supplements are called supplements for a reason.They are supplement to something.

But in cases where you are not able to meet your dietary choices, you are a vegetarian, you are struggling for some things, I don't see anything wrong with taking supplements.As long as you know.Raj, my philosophy with food is I'm not a health nerd.I don't track calories, I don't track protein.I take directionally one side, I occasionally indulge too.And I told you, I have lost 15 kilos of weight and I am maintaining it too.

So, for me… Can you tell me about that?Good food.

Like I said, first, I told you my secret mantra, we are eating a lot of fermented food, we are eating a lot of millets at home.and sunlight.And I think I've been living like a farmer.What do you mean by that?Explain.So again, I come from agriculture, so I understand farmers better.

So, you know, you can actually eat like and live like a farmer.That's the best way to do things.What did farmers do?They used to eat twice a day.two or two and a half times according to your lifestyle.You can choose.

Eat seasonal, eat fresh.Lot of sunlight, movement.That's non -negotiable.You can't be healthy just by eating.You should have a very good movement.Stress.

If you can't leave your house open today, the farmer leaves his crop in the field and goes to sleep.He goes to sleep, where pests are roaming, where animals are roaming, it's raining, everything.to itni accha jo stress manage karne ka unka ability.To if you can, you should live like a farmer.I'm not saying ki unke jitna khana khana shuru ghar do ghar aap sedentary lifestyle ghar rahe ho, but there's a lot that you can pick from.

But yeh kaise ho sakta hai?This stress where a lot of people don't care about what's going on in life the way probably according to you what farmer is doing.So hogaya wahi pe unko koi farki nahi pad raha.It can be true for a lot of farmers.It is true for a lot of farmers.

I think, again, this is also a community way of living, where you have a lot of assurances.You were living in a big family, which becomes your support system.We are getting into nuclear families, where you are on your own.Success is yours, failure is also yours.Everything there used to belong to the community.Even if someone fell, people used to pick him up.

And I think that is the main cause.They contribute, they believe in that system of community.So, do you still go to your village?I do.

You do?

Have you seen...I have to go, but I try.We have a small land parcel there.

Nice, you go there.I go there.Right.So, when you go there, have you seen that people are very easily ready to buy lab -made seeds there?

But these are not lab -made seeds.Okay.Isn't it like some way?No, these are not lab -made seeds at all.You asked a very important question.Bio -fortification is being done by farmers themselves for centuries.

Plant breeding, bio -fortification is done through conventional breeding.This system of getting married is done by farmers.Scientists have just started doing it.They have been doing it for centuries.Let me give you an example.Do you eat carrot pudding?

Yes.

Which one?Orange carrot?Yes.It's orange, right?

You had to have white halwa if this plant hadn't been bred.

Carrots were never orange.Carrots used to be black, yellow, white.Orange used to be very little, but mostly this color of carrots.

I mean, absolutely orange.Like a reddish orange.

What happened in the 16th century?Dutch farmers bred yellow carrots.They started making orange carrots.The reason for that was that the orange carrots were sweet.They had beta carotene in them.They were uniform.

And their yield was also high.The same concept that we are thinking of doing for biofertification today.

They started breeding them.

There are two reasons for that.One was this.The second reason is a little political.But that shows how important politics plays a role.So there was a national hero of William of Orange.I think when he was revolted against Spain, he participated a lot in that.

Carrots were oranged to pay tribute to him.Dutch national color was also orange.So this carrot turned orange.First, because of these traits.Second, He wanted to make it orange, William of Orange.So, long story short, the carrots that you have been eating for so many years, are made from the same process that the farmers selected and made your carrots orange.

Now, one more interesting thing about this is that the black carrot is coming back.It is coming back because it had anthocyanins in it.which are also found in blueberries, are good for health.Now, North India is such a place, when carrots became orange everywhere, North Indian ones, because North India, we go in a slightly different direction, so we retained black carrots there too.There were a couple of reasons for that, that in North India, one is in winters, it is black carrots, in winters, winters used to fall there, so black carrots stopped there.They used to make a black carrot drink, a kanji.

And that drink...

But is there a problem in eating the orange carrot?No, there is no problem.It has beta carotene.It has vitamins.

Okay.

You have done the color like this.It's not a chemical process or something.It's not a chemical.It's just a story that you told me about how they change.

It's about that you prioritized a trait.You prioritized beta carotene.It was vitamin A rich at the time when you needed it.Because vitamin A is a very important thing.Do you know that every year in India, 50 ,000 children go blind?because of vitamin A deficiency.

50 ,000 kids.It starts with night blindness.Vitamin A is a pigment in our retina.It is needed for that.When it is not present in the vitamin A diet, they have night blindness.They lose their vision in the evening.

And if you keep ignoring it, it turns into permanent blindness.

Tell me more about foods and these vitamins.Let's say sweet potato.I saw that you guys make orange sweet potato.

Yeah, orange -fleshed sweet potato, OSP, it has vitamin A again.You know, sweet potato is considered to be a good food.When we were talking about Okinawa, there is also sweet potato there.By the way, it is a very important food.So sweet potato has energy, it has fiber.It is a staple food of many places.

So, in Africa, orange flesh sweet potato was made in many places so that it can get rid of vitamin A, because it is a staple food.So, like in Africa, there is a lot of vitamin A maize.In India, we don't work much on maize.There are high iron beans.different crops.The concept was Biofortification Priority Index.

It's a bit scientific.The idea is that you can't run after every crop like this.You have a limited budget, right?So, what should you do?So, you have to catch crops that are staple crops.Where maximum nutrition is going from you.

This is one criteria.Second, which nutrient do you have to catch?You have to catch the one that has the most deficiency in that country.So, you decide from these two that if India is here, then there is wheat, then there is zinc.I will build its variety.

So that's why in India, what do you put in beet, zinc and rice?Zinc, rice again.Okay.And for iron, it goes in bajra and lentils.Only these two particular vitamins or micronutrients you focus on?Zinc and iron?

So, there are four major deficiencies of micronutrients worldwide.

They are Iodine, Zinc, Iron and Vitamin A. Iodine we are getting from salt.So that's more or less sorted.

These three are now coming through biofortification.

Interesting.So these vitamin A blindness.Iron is cognitive and anemia.Zinc is Wi -Fi.Very interesting analogy.Okay.

And then fourth was iodine.Iodine.

Yeah.Thyroid and goiter problems and plus mental.You know, nutrition approaches work.Another way of biofortification is agronomic biofortification.Like I told you, you can do yoga, but don't awaken your kundali, awaken your shakti, right?Update your seed software.

Another concept is again fromIndian philosophy only, that is vastu.

Vastu, malum aapko kya hota hai?

Architecture ko jo hum, you know, align karte hain.Seed ka ghar kya hai?Seed ka ghar to soil hai.Humne baat ki ki agar soil me hi zinc nahi hoga, iron nahi hoga, to seed wahan se pull nahi kar paayega.To agar hum seed ka vastu theek kar de, matlab hum uski soil ko theek kar de, So we can bring nutrition to our foods.So there is a very interesting story about Finland.

In Finland, in the 1970s, many people were having heart attacks.

Cardiovascular problem.

Highest in the world.They were very happy.No, they did a lot of research on what the problem is.One of the key reasons was that there was no selenium in their soil.So you need selenium for your heart health.So his government took a decision, I think in 1984.

They said that you can't sell any fertilizer in this country if you don't add selenium to it.One strong decision.You have to add as much selenium as the quantity they have decided in every fertilizer.Results started coming after five years.Selenium increased three times in their food.It started coming in their blood serum twice.

And he got this response in the first five years.A decade later,75 % drop in cardiovascular disease.It's one of the big success stories.You don't have to go to the pharmacy to solve the problem.You can solve the problem even in the field.

Interesting.And this is a very big success story.Tell me about more countries and what those countries are doing.have done in order to tackle their food problem or deficiency problems or whatever other problems they could.

Like in Kenya, for iron deficiency, they work on high iron beans.Like we eat kidney beans, they have a staple, so they eat it.So there, in school feeding, promoting beans in school feeding.The problem there was that these beans, because the supply was low, were expensive.They were sold at twice the price.There was a variety called Neota, which we released, which was sold at double the price.

Kidney beans?One kind of kidney beans.So, they were If you want to do any such intervention on a scale, then budget neutrality is the first thing to do.And there was a very interesting reason for the beans to become popular.We gave it to high iron beans, because there was a lot of iron, but children and teachers liked it for a different reason.There is a very big social risk in eating kidney beans.

You become a balloon.You do a lot of gas.So flatulence was one of the big problems in the beans.So this was unintended.So the biochemistry of the variety we made changed so much that they used to reduce the gas.

So people started liking it a lot.

Another important thing about beans is that it takes a little time to cook beans.This variety had less cooking time.So the ladies adopted it a lot.So there is a demand pull.Sometimes it comes from such a place.We are working on a lot of things.

We say that our product reduces stunting.But a Gen Z guy, his brain fog is getting better.Because of that, he is picking it.So beans were very popular.So there was a big problem of budget neutrality.So, we did some de -bottlenecking there.

We worked with the Agricultural University.Fixed the seed system.And fast forward two years, its budget neutrality, Neota beans started selling at the price of normal beans.So, for a school, there are a lot of organizations involved to scale that innovation.Because it is a very good innovation for children.

Fantastic.Tell me, how can we help?Everybody who's listening to this conversation, how can...We help in making sure that nutrient rich food, everybody starts eating much faster than what probably you must have projected.Because it's good for our country.It's good for us as it's good for our families.

I think power is in communication.Communication is needed.The first thing you can do is that you can give a shout out to my 15 lakh kids who will probably watch this.You are the future.Eat well.Secondly, as I was telling you about Nutri Patshala, there is a very interesting component in it.

We call it Nutri Buddies.So, the schools where we work, the students of the colleges of agriculture, food science, or nutrition colleges, they come as volunteers.We train them.Then they spend about 20 hours with these kids.What was happening with the kids, we...They don't want to listen to their parents.

They don't want to listen to people like us.They still listen to their elder siblings because there is less generation gap.So, in the beginning, we struggled a lot to make them understand.But from their face, it is clear that this is not a reception.Then we thought a little about how this can be done.Of course, we train teachers.

But there is a different kind of relationship with teachers.They want to listen, but they don't want to do it at home.But when we came up with a concept of NutriBuddies, these kids They go to schools and gamify nutrition.They teach them why to eat omelettes in a good, entertaining way.You know, how much sugar is in the drinks they are drinking.They teach them all these things.

So NutriBuddies has become a core spine of our program.

For kids of the same age?

Yes.Either they are in the final year or have graduated from these colleges.They do this as a volunteer exercise.There is one more thing that we can do.Like I told you, Gen Z is going to fix this system.I'm so positive about it.

This is the smartest generation that we could have ever got.So you need more of them to join you?We need more of the Gen Z to take the lead, to ask questions.See, what used to happen in our time?Someone said that glucose biscuit is healthy.We agreed.

Someone said that this drink is healthy.We agreed.We used to accept whatever was said to us.This is the generation who flip the packet.They fall behind.They press the button to ask questions.

And there are creators too.If they don't understand something,then they take the founder and make him straight in six hours.

So, this generation is a very powerful generation.

And the interesting thing is that we have seen that people in urban are asking and reading labels.And Gen Z is getting more inclined towards the natural label, where natural nutrition comes.So, I have a hope that where it comes to fixing the food system, Gen Z will have a huge role to play.All they need to do is just start asking question, where is my nutrition?Give it back.You have no right to take it away from my plate.

True.And what's next for you?Where do you see yourself going forward?

Right now, I'm thinking We dreamt small.We would have had bigger dreams.When Dr. Howard Weiss started, his dream was that we will reach 1 billion people by 2030.We're already at now 589 million.So I think we will do that.So now that dream has started to seem small.

I think there's a lot of work to do.What's your biggest fear?

My biggest fear is someone destroying this innovation by making wrong claims.Explain it.So it happens that when protein came, it came with very good intent.We had a need.And then we saw all kinds of things, right?There are people who come in, make claims, which are not fully scientific.

And then they, that, that start hurting the category at some point of time.And this is, this is, this happens with any science.And then my second fear is, we havestarted celebrating storytelling more than science.And that's something that worries me.And then my second question is, tell me the names of five scientists of this century.

And generally there is silence.I ask the same question for India.So people in India also tell their names.Adani, Ambani, so people know.So I ask, tell me the names of five Indian scientists.So very rarely, I think the last memory people have is Dr. Kalam.

Very few people can tell about KSA -1, about Ratanlal, about Gagandeep Kang.Because we don't celebrate science.We celebrate storytelling more.If you look at our innovation ecosystem, we file 80 ,000 patents a year.

China does 16 lakhs, 15 lakhs.

So where does that difference come from?That difference comes from how much you can prioritize science and innovation.If you look at our R &D spend as a country, 0 .67%.Countries like South Korea, Israel spend up to 5%.And it's the same in the private sector.If you look at the private sector, we spend less than 2 % of our R &D.

Do you know how much is the marketing budget?In some cases, it will run up to 40%.18%.Think about the engine.We have a car, very beautiful, metallic paint.There is no engine in it.

So we are making beautiful cars with no engine.That's my biggest worry.A country like us has to prioritize science and prioritize innovation.

Marketing is not bad.

But then you can't market if you don't have an idea, if you don't have an innovation.If the business goes away tomorrow, maybe our growth will go away.But if there is no science, there will be no civilization.So I think people need to celebrate science more.

Interesting.Tell me one last question.Fill in the blank.India will not be able to grow if dash.

India will not be able to go if we don't stop the nutrition heist.

But on all four levels, you said the nutrition heist, At the soil level, at the crop level, at the factory level, and then at the plate level, right?So you are addressing the crop level.How will you address the soil level?How will you explain it to the factory?What will you do after coming to the plate?

I think we have discussed about the plate that there is a lot of awareness that's needed about doing good.That's coming.Slowly.That's coming.At the factory level is consumer.Factories are like the lamp of God.

The consumer will give what he asks for.When you are asking them for taste, they are giving you taste.The day you start asking for nutrition, they will find it and bring it to you.And mark my words, biofortification is going to be the biggest category in next five years.My estimate is it's going to be $20 billion in India alone.And if we play it right, India has an opportunity to become the affordable nutrition hub.

We have all the pieces.India has done very well in two or three innovations.One is seed system.The seed systems in India are really strong.So that's the basic piece that you need for biofortification.Your captive consumption is large.

And third, you have a problem.So you have the customer, you have the context, you have the capacity.

These three Cs are required.This was taught in our consulting.So I think we have all the basics to reach there.To answer your question, law of limiting factors.You can't leave anyone.You will have to eat all four meals.

Soil, we need to fix it.If our soils are dead, we are doomed.Seed, we are doing through biofortification.Factories, the consumers.Gen Z has to play a huge role.Ask questions.

Keep flipping the packet.Say that I don't care about the celebrity's photo in the front.Tell me the signs and label at the back.Tell me these two things.

And then kitchen is very much in our hands.Perfect.Well, thank you so much, sir.Thank you.It was a pretty straight conversation.It's been such a long time where I've had this kind of straightforward conversation where I don't have things to ask.

I just wanted to just understand and see and hear you about the things that you were talking about.Andit was incredible to hear that.In fact, I really like what you're doing.So all the best to you as well and kudos.Thank you for so much for this conversation.

Thank you very much.And I'd like I said, thank you for inviting an agriculturist.

I think you're the first agriculturalist we've had on the podcast now.

So the folks back in Punjab Agricultural University and manage, I mean, by the way, Agribusiness MBA exists.

Thank you so much for watching this episode till the end.Now you have to do three things.Number one, subscribe to this channel right now.Because the more you subscribe, the better we will be able to bring guests for you.Number two, please tell us in the comments what we did wrong and what we did right so that we can learn from that feedback and create a better experience for you.And number three, do share this episode with at least one person because one conversation is enough to change someone's life.

I'll see you next time.Until then, keep figuring out.