West Ham vs Arsenal drama UNPACKED! 🤯 | The Gary Neville Podcast 🎙️

Well, hello everybody, it's the Gary Neville podcast.Amid a certain amount of emotional exhaustion at the London Stadium, off the back of a heart -thumping, gut -wrenching football match.At the end of which, Arsenal are two games away from being the champions of England, Gary.But, I mean, what a tale to tell.

Yeah, I don't know where you start really, other than the fact that there is always a game.that goes down in folklore when you go on to win a Premier League title, where the emotions, the rollercoaster, the ups and downs of just thinking you've lost it, you've won it, you've lost it again, you've won it again.And from the David Ryer save to the Trossard goal to the disallowed goal for West Ham at the end, that was 10 minutes that Arsenal fans will never forget.There are Arsenal fans who might be in their senior years who remember 89, who remember the drama and the thrill of what happened at Anfield that night.And obviously there are big moments at Old Trafford with Ville Tord and over Mars back in the day where they won titles, but that will be right up there with them.It can never match 89.

I don't think because that was just so special.But yeah, if they go on to win it in a couple of weeks time, they will have been through the mill today.But there's always I mean, I said partway through the second half.There's always one like this, and I think it had all the hallmarks of a title winning half the keepers save.Let's just hang on that for a second because the keepers outstanding and he has been outstanding all season.He's job brilliantly today, but you keep will need to make a huge one on one save at some point in a title winning running where almost like I said, Time stands still, and it's like and you

bumps.And you're almost like, you can't believe that that's all happened in probably one or two seconds in total.But it felt like forever for me.It just felt like, oh, it's here.And it was Son against Ortega.that.

You know, obviously, a moment a couple of years ago as the arsenal were on the wrong end of that, and so many more good one at the back post against Villa.I think in, you know, obviously, Aguero's but these moments that just sort of come.Steve Bruce against Sheffield Wednesday.These so you're just these sort of moments come through today to me, and there's probably a load more, but that riot save was the start of it.That's where you're thinking, right?Okay, it's I used to say this thing when it's And these Arsenal players have never won a Premier League title before, but if they ever listen to the Gary Neville podcast, which I doubt they do, something's happening.

Something's just happened out there today that you can't put down to skill or anything other than you just looking up there and thinking everything went right for us.And then they score the goal.a bit of quality, a one, two between Declan Rice and Odegaard.And I have to say, Odegaard, when he came on, was very important, because when everything around you is really fast, and it feels like there is a fire burning, you need someone who's cold.And I thought Odegaard actually provided some real composure in the last 15 minutes.I thought he was really important.

Just someone who just makes the game slower, who just gets a control of it, who plays that final pass with the right pace, to the right angle, to the right foot.And he did it perfectly.And then, the drama of all dramas.We think Arsenal have lost it.We think West Ham have scored.Manchester City fans at home are celebrating.

Tottenham fans are thinking, oh, no.And Darren England, it's all eyes on him.We actually at the start don't know.I mean, one thing at the start was, was it over the line?That was the thing that I think I was thinking.But it looked over the line for me and Declan Rice, as it turned out, was way behind the line.

But then we see, obviously, a VAR check for a foul on the goalkeeper.And I think that's the biggest moment in VR history in the Premier League and for those who may be and there are a lot who aren't fans of VR and maybe rightly so, but tonight it could have just made Arsenal champions and it could have got a decision right that wouldn't have been right.And I was wondering whether Darren England had the courage, had the nerve to overturn and what was he going to do in this moment?I have to say we get the luxury of and I wish all fans at home and I wish all fans in the stadium got the luxury of VR being able to hear them because, to be fair, he was composed.He was walking through it.He was talking to the referee.

He was talking to obviously is compassion or his colleague who was sat next to him, and he walked through it perfectly checked everything around it.There was a little file by Declan Rice behind.I think that was maybe after the riot foul.And just the fact that Pablo just had his arm if Pablo would have been jumping like this.I think with leverage as a as a defender as an attacker would do that.I would have said no problem.

I think that he should be entitled to go for it.But he didn't.He just had his arm that he wasn't looking at the ball.He wasn't looking to play the ball, and he was looking just to sort of impede the goalkeeper, and he left his arm in that sort of location for a second or two.And I think that is the problem.If it's just one of those

where you sort of just going up as a sort of like a movement, then I think maybe that's something that you would have got away with.But that prolonged lasting.Sort of arm across the sort of what we this position here of riot to me has to then call it and Darren England made the right decision and Chris breathe the biggest sigh of relief probably that those fans have breathed for a long, long time.

From a human perspective, for Darren England, under immense scrutiny.And we don't often spend a lot of time bigging up these guys.Indeed, they take a lot of stick.Darren England was the bloke probably at the centre of the lowest point in the history of Premier League VAR.I don't know.These are football fans.

They don't really care.They care whether their team wins or not, ultimately.But you've got to feel some human warmth on his behalf, because what an extraordinary moment in his professional life.

I mean, you're talking about the Luis Diaz incident, Tottenham Liverpool, a few years ago, which was obviously a shocker.And it was a massive low point.And I thought your line was a great line, that the moment that he was experiencing, he may still be experiencing it now.because he'll be waiting to see the fallout of the decision and what the reaction is.So what we say on sky, what the sort of match of the day will be on tonight and the other channels will obviously all have opinions and talk sport and all the other channels.I mentioned them all because they'll all be assessing this decision.

But if they see it like I saw it, he got it absolutely spot on.And you made a brilliant point that that it was the most pressurized decision that he'll get, and he's got an FA Cup final coming up.He won't have anything in the FA Cup final that canthat.Because the title is there in that moment.It's in the hands of the officials.

But that's what they are was brought in to do to correct wrongs to write wrongs in big moments where the players and I remember we lost the title one year to Chelsea, where did the age and we probably may have deserved to lose the title overall to tell us that season, but we did lose that game at Old Trafford.The day drug was offside, and if we'd had VR, we potentially could have been champions.And then maybe Chelsea would have had decisions earlier in the season as well that they would have had overturned.So I'm not looking for Chelsea fans to be referee and back in history, but you do feel it was a big moment for VR.I what they have been thinking tonight.If that had not been overturned, they would have been thinking we've been wronged.

So for me, yeah, it was a huge decision.A big moment for Darren England, a big moment for Chris cabinets.He starts to go over and see it through, which they obviously mainly do.But I mean, what a big moment for Arsenal.I mean, the roller coaster of conceding the goal and then back up to the VAR decision overturning it is a monumental swing in eight minutes, nine minutes of a football match and completely and utterly draining.the game really well.

I thought the first 15 20 minutes.They were really positive.I thought they had something going down this side.We try siding California.They had something going on the corners in the set pieces.They were playing it forward.

And when you've got a team at the bottom at the start of a match against the team at the top, it can be their weakest moment.But if they get through it, they start to grow and start to get get encouragement.And that's what happened.And there was a big moment in the first this is a game changer for Michael Arteta.I mean, obviously, winning the Champions League is huge, but it will not give him the credibility.that a Premier League title would have given me absolutely will not.

You have to win a Premier League title.I think to get the credibility as a manager where he's been in an endurance test, a marathon against Pep Guardiola, and he's got to come out on top in one of these sort of what would be clashes to see this true credibility.Of course, you'll get plaudits.And you'll be a legend if you win the Champions League with the managerial sort of what would be landscape.You go on to a completely different level, and he got a little bit lucky today, Michael Arteta, and it's not for me to start telling Michael Arteta how to coach a football team or how to make substitutes.But sometimes it's just glaringly wrong.

First of all, Glenn Ben White hangs his leg out, and I think I made the point on commentary.And by the way, I'm gonna tell a story now.I actually have done what Ben White did.I did it in training.And I went out for a drink on a Saturday night, which I never did ever.But we didn't have a game for 10 days.

It was the right moment for me to go out and have a drink on a Saturday night.And I actually did my medial ligament in training on the Monday morning.And I went in for a challenge, and I can't remember who it was with.And if you're going for a challenge, a block tackle, and you just hang your leg out away from your body like that, and you lean back a little bit, you'll get that rock ofyour sort of knee and you'll basically, particularly if someone goes in solid, so you have to lean into it and go really in strong, put your power forward and really go like, you have to really block and sort of make sure you set your thigh, you set your core, you make sure you lean forward and everything.If you just do that and hang your leg out, you've got a good chance you'll do your medial ligament.

And Ben White did that, and he'll regret that, because that could see him out of a World Cup.We don't know.We haven't got the diagnosis yet.But they're usually four - to six -week injuries, which would be obviously a big problem for Ben White in terms of not just a World Cup, but a Champions League final and a title running.Let's hope it's not that bad.But that type of injury comes from that challenge.

And then Michael Arteta brought Zubermandi on.And I remember, I think it was our director said, Zubermendi's coming on, because they sometimes get the nod from the floor manager down beneath, don't they, from Brett's down there.And I was like, Zuberman, he's gone.And I went, okay, well, I've never seen Myles Lewis Skelly play right back.That was my immediate response.I was like, and I went down to our stats and research team and said, has Myles Lewis Skelly ever played right back?

And they went, well, there's no evidence of him ever playing right back.I'm thinking, well, Calafiore must go over to right back then in my head.I didn't say that, but, and then he went and put Declan Rice at right back.And straight away, I thought, no, no, for a number of reasons.One is, I think you're taking the energy out of midfield.you're disrupting two positions rather than one.

So you bring my scare on it right back.You're just disrupting the defense disrupting the defense on the midfield.And the big thing is, you cannot take Declan Rice out of central midfield.Now I know Roy Keane played in the early parts of his United Korea when Paul Lynch was there, I think a few games at right back and Stephen Gerrard, believe it, and I think played a fewat right back as well, but in the early parts of his career, you can't move Roy Keane and Steven Gerrard in a game of this magnitude out of central midfield.They are forces of nature.

You can't move deck line.I'm not giving Declan Rice the same sort of level yet as Roy Keane, Steven Gerrard, but he has that level of influence on Arsenal.And when Declan Rice went to right back, it didn't only do the things that I've just mentioned from an arsenal perspective.I reckon those West.Well, I'm absolutely certain those West Ham players on the pitch.Somerville will have thought Declan Rice not played here before.

He doesn't know the position.I think the midfield players Fernandez and so check will have thought I've got super Mendy and Miles Lewis Skelly rather than rice.I'm really happy in here and also from a defensive point of view, you take away it was a really, really poor decision.And I don't think you can sort of try and sell that.Oh, yeah, I was always going to do it just a lifetime and it was just a really.It was just a it further exacerbates by the fact that he has to take Califiori off, who I think, again, I'm using the word force of nature, but down this left -hand side, I mean, he's not Maldini by any stretch of the imagination, Califiori, let's be really clear, but you understand the sort of similarities I'm sort of pointing toward.

He's got that athleticism about him, that when he runs forward, it's very difficult to stop.You then put he's not played for.I mean, played their course he has, but you've taken him out of midfield now.So you end up with rice and Zuberman do which wasn't as effective in the last few weeks.That's why we've ended up with are still playing Zuberman.Miles Lewis, Kelly and rice.

And you'veended up there having to make another substitution.So it just exacerbates the situation.And he was always chasing his substitutions.And then towards the end, when he would have had a substitution left, if he got the first one right, he would have brought in Kapia on for Miles Lewis Skelly at left back, I'm sure, and had a tall back four.But he couldn't do because he'd used all his subs.

The good one he brought on was, oh my goodness, Urdegaard, because Urdegaard was a game changer out there for Arsenal.He really was.He came on today.and he really did deliver in that last 15 minutes, not just with the goal, just these moments of just basically sort of bringing a level of soft class into a game, which was really poor quality.And so you have to make our the most important thing is the one that got over the line, how they got over the line, who the hell knows in the end, we don't even know ourselves.But I have to say it was an up and down day for Arsenal fans, but it was an up and down day for Mikel Arteta during the game with his substitutes.

Is it conceivable they'll drop a point now, or do they beat Burnley and Palace and are we done?

I think they'll, ordinarily when this happens, Arsenal beat Burnley, I think City beat Palace, I think Arsenal beat Burnley, and I think Arsenal win it on the Tuesday night, the 19th of May. to be fair.I've got that ability to go right to the end.But I think this is a hammer blow for city.Really They've got the game Wednesday against Palace.They've got the cup final against Chelsea next Saturday, so they can win a domestic double, which is a big achievement, by the way, and deserve someyou're going to do it.

And then they've got to go to Bournemouth on the Tuesday, and I think that could just be maybe a step too far with how Bournemouth are right now, and it's been a real his last game at Bournemouth and.Just the fact they're a good side and the type of team I called this today.A dog of a game for Arsenal.It was a dog of a game.This I think the game a week on Tuesday is a dog of a game for Manchester City, and I think that's when it in my mind if you Interesting.

We'll see how that plays out.What about West Ham?How do they come back from here?They've got to go to Newcastle and then they've got a home game here against Leeds, who by the way are now safe, which affects the dynamic of their game at Tottenham tomorrow, of course, all of that.But essentially, West Ham have two wins would take them to 42 points and that still might not be enough.Can they win the last two off the back of what they've just been through here?

I mean, Peter, that Trossard goal could be the it's the most important goal in Arsenal's recent history in the Premier League.that cross our goal is the most important goal potentially in Tottenham's entire Premier League history, just and the VR decision at the end is potentially the biggest VR call in Premier League history.The Tottenham Hotspur Football Club because they now tomorrow night have an opportunity to go four points clear, don't they?And that's a massive, massive incentive to go to go into that game, and they needed their great rivals to do them a favor today.I think new known knew at the end when that goal was disallowed.that potentially could be it.

I think he realized that he needed something out of the game.Um, and he's taught them do the job tomorrow night.I think that's it.I think they'll get over the line.I think it'll be too much for West Ham and look, these are two great football clubs.Um, taught them a flirted with, I say, flirted with relegation.

They've flirted around the bottom 45 of theleague in the last couple of years.West Ham have done it over a number of years and sometimes have successes, but sometimes they've moved up the league quite often.They've been fighting relegation in the last 14 years.Did you say that they've been in the Premier League, but they've had a few.There are quite a few relegation battles along the way, haven't they?

I'm asking for the game.What What is the financial stability of West?I'm right now to be able to go down.What happens?Have they got the muscle to be able to keep?You know, keep most of these players together because that team there today that with those three center backs those two wing backs, you know the quality they've got with Boeing, Castellanos, Pablo Somerville, so check and Fernandez if they can keep the majority of those together, they'll come back up again.

But if someone comes and pinches Boeing, it.It's a really important period.I never liked talking about the teams going down talking about them.I never liked the idea of teams getting relegated because it's desperate.But I will be happy this year.Two different clubs are going down and I think we needed that sort of rot of the sort of same teams going up and down to break.

We needed that to change.So I'm really happy about that, and it was always going to mean that one of the clubs that may be a bit more of a stalwart in the Premier League going to go down.But actually, it needs that it needs a Tottenham to go down.It needs a West Ham to go down to demonstrate that the competitive element of the Premier League at the bottom is still there.So, yeah, unfortunate for West Ham fans.They've been through a roller coaster today, but I do

think that tomorrow night leads might be free as a bird tomorrow night and just play beautifully became to all traffic a few weeks ago.Under pressure.We were there on a Monday night, and they played absolutely incredibly to go and beat Manchester United to nil.So they've got it in them.But will and wake up in the morning just that little bit more chilled and just stick a little bit more extra milk on your cereal, a little bit more cereal in there, maybe have a bacon sandwich, you know what I mean?It sounds crazy, but you just, but it won't do I'm sure, but you know the idea of just relaxing, because it's a battle.

the Premier League.It's a massive event for these clubs to stay in the Premier League that come up from the championship and Daniel Farka.I went.When were those games against Chelsea in Liverpool?The Manchester City in a week was in November, October.November was there and I was up two of those games.

The writing was on the wall for him.So for him to come out of where he was is a brilliant sort of performance from leads and from the manager.And so, yeah, tomorrow night, West Ham United's Premier League and that isn't helpful.I think that goal at the end would have meant leads would have had to have gone and sort of got something tomorrow night, which would have.Is that right, Peter?Yeah, which which means that.

This is something.There's an edge on it for leads.Whereas that edge is now not there for leads.And what you're actually asking for is the leads players to be exactly the same as they were if they were under pressure, and that's difficult enough.If you've already won the league, I'll just transfer it to the top.If you've you've already saved relegation, you just step off it.

I'm not just accusing lead players tomorrow night.I'm just stepping off it Villa last week when they sort of thought that they were okay and that they could concentrate on the Europa League game.They just step off it in a game againstForest.So those things naturally do happen.

On West Ham, you mentioned the players, the top players who might go, it's hard to imagine Jared Bowen playing in the championship, isn't it?Almost certainly.But what about the manager?Because there's been a bit of a narrative this week.The stories have begun around West Ham folk reportedly saying, whatever happens, Nuno, please stay.And it's a pity for them, it's more than a pity, but they appear to be on the way down, not confirmed.

he's got a lot of confidence in him.He's got a lot of confidence in him having created a little bit of something.There's been a vibe here in recent weeks like you know that they don't today.They didn't necessarily look like a relegation team.How important for them that he is convinced to stay.Do you think he's the right sort of guy to have?

Yeah, whatever they need to do to keep him, they should keep him because what that will do is stabilize things.It will stop the domino you know, the rest of them then that are still left have got excuses and the fans become demotivated.So if you're in order of a club that goes down what you want to do initially, what you want to do straight away.Is hang on to your manager if he's the one that's not taking now, which you know, hasn't.So he's the one that basically, I think, is giving them hope.And then what you probably have to do is go to a Boeing.

to be in the championship for more than one year.and you're part of the problem guys in this last 12 months, you're the ones that have basically contributed to taking us down.I get the fact that ultimately we all take responsibility.It's collective efforts and collectively we lose and we win together.But you're part of this and you try and basically stabilize everything.And particularly, I think Boeing and Nuno would be the two big things that you'd look to sort of hang on to now.

you're going to have to lose a Fernandez or a Boeing or two.You know, I mean, so that that that's that.That's the thing.I don't know financial situation and what are the owners got left in muscle to be able to keep a Boeing Fernandez and others that I think you know would be.you know, hoiked off them by other clubs.

These days, please correct me if I'm wrong, but these days, they don't stay where they go down, do they?I mean, West Ham fans, for instance, of a certain generation will remember when West Ham went down in the 70s, their Jared Bowen was Trevor Brookings.And Trevor Brookings stayed and came back up.

Yeah, but did Newcastle go down?

They did keep a few.

Who stayed at Newcastle?And I think Newcastle fans absolutely loved him.I can't remember who it was now.But Newcastle went down, didn't they?And I think that they kept you know, he's he's he's from this neck of the woods.

Well, not originally, but he's married into this.

No, I'm saying Yeah, but I mean, he's almost like tied to the club.It feels like he's wedded to the club does.It's almost I don't think he'd be getting cheered back like Declan Rice, potentially.I don't know.I just look at it and think, he came from Hull.He was at Hull, wasn't he?

He was at Hull.

Yeah.

I mean, he's a Herefordshire man.Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But it feels like he is West Ham, you know what I mean?It just feels like he is.Look, let's see what happens.I don't know the financial strength of the owners.I don't know what's going to happen.But Nuno, I think, absolutely, is the first person you've been knocking on the door and saying, look, commit.

And let's get this announced, by the way, in the next election.The minute we go down, if we do go down, Nuno stays is the first thing you want to be saying to fans so that you can say, right, OK, don't demoralize them even more than what being relegated would do.

So let's finish on Arsenal, because they're the top headline.In 1999, you were chasing the title and the European Cup.As it happens, you were chasing the FA Cup as well, were you not?But you know how it feels.You know how the next fortnight feels.for Arsenal.

So just finished by telling us that.

Yeah, we were.We had such momentum.Arsenal have got such momentum right now, beating Atletico Madrid over two legs.City dropping points at Everton, winning today in the way in which they have.Winning today in the way in which they have is far more special than winning the game 3 -0.You'd much more like, you'd love to win games 3 -0 so you're comfortable.

But winning that type of game you've got to build your confidence, your resilience, your momentum more than anything else.There is they should be absolutely in dreamland tonight.These are still players.They should be unstoppable.They should be absolutely unstoppable.Nothing should be able to stop them.

Now there should be no obstacle that you could put in front of them that they wouldn't be able to get out of the way.Because they've got past the that we looked at and thought it's a horrible game, and they still got a job doing the last two, but I just don't see how you can't be unstable.And then you get to the final of the Champions League, and they've somehow got to think about the defensive ability and strength and how.Can they over 90 minutes be a team are better than us.They are.You can't get away from that.

PSG are a better team in Arsenal right now.They'veto be able to prepare.

Less than that.

Is it 31st?Is it?

It's the week after the final game.

He's got two weeks from now.Is he a bit?Yeah, you're two weeks from now.He's got a week after the of the club by winning a title to win Arsenal's first Champions League and in a season where they win the Premier League for the first time in 22 years.I mean, you're talking about this is a game changer today for Michaela to turn the Arsenal players.Winning this and the Champions League puts them onto a different level, and that's going to be tough because the playing as the team are absolutely stunning.

Absolutely stunning, but it's 90 minutes of football.But what a lot they have to look forward to.and it felt like the right moment for us.For now, it feels like the right moment for me for Arsenal to win a league.It doesn't quite feel like the right moment for them to win a Champions League.It feels like PSG could be the right moment for them to win back to back and for Enrique to put himself up there with the godlike managers that have done this.

It feels like more that than maybe Arsenal winning a double.But it doesn't really matter if Arsenal were to lose in that final and win the Premier League.I would still say it's a sensational season.And if they were to go and win the Champions League and the Premier League double, it would be a yeah.I mean, that's putting them into a different stratosphere of sort of what will be credit and belief and legacy.But we still shouldn't forget about Pep Guardiola, who might still have something to say.

But it does feel like now it's Arsenal's.

Well, we'll see what happens next fortnight.Well done, Gary.Thank you.Thank you.